CURVES: Negotiating the $10,000 Closing Fee
October 12, 2009
Struggling, failing and soon-to-close Curves franchise owners share information and advice on both Unhappy Franchisee and Franchise Pick posts. One of the frequent topics is the club closing procedures, and how to negotiate with Curves International in regard to their demands for a $10,000 “failure fee” and often tens of thousands of dollars for “future royalties.”
From the post CURVES: Robert Lay’s Story, here’s a recent exchange regarding the $10,000 closing fee:
Donna Submitted on 2009/10/08 at 2:41pm
HELP!!! I have read some of the horror stories listed. I to have to close my club. I can not get anyone to return my calls from CI. I do not know what to do. I have had my club almost 7 years and have paid my dues. I do not have 10,000 dollars. Because of the recession I have to close. I love my members and hate to dissapoint them but I have no choice. The closing packet was sent to me but I’m scared to send it in. Is there any help out there? I have to do what I need to do today. Will they let me out without the 10,000 fee. Has anyone out there been in my shoes. Please someone respond as I need advice and help NOW.
CA ex-owner Submitted on 2009/10/08 at 8:21pm
We’ve all been there! Our club has been closed for over a year. We refused to pay the $10,000. They emailed us two more times, first lowering it to $8,000, then to $6,000 – we still refused. Next came a letter from Curves Legal stating we now owed fees for the remainder of our franchise agreement, somewhere in the amount of over $42,000, with a fair amount of scare tactics! (Read our story above: CA Ex-owner on October 16th, 2008) We then sent a letter back to legal, refusing to pay anything and the reasons why. Now I will knock on wood before I say this, but it has been over a year that we sent them that letter and we have not heard a thing yet.
We are not part of the legal action that many of the people above are pursuing, and I’m sure someone will respond on how to proceed in that direction, or direct you to on what other options you may have. Remember, you are not alone, we’ve all been through this horrible experience. It hardly makes it better, but at least maybe knowing there are so many of us out there, you might feel a little better…
Another Curver Submitted on 2009/10/09 at 12:15pm
Hi Donna.
Like You, I had to close my club. I closed it Feb 28th this year…
Of course I did everything I could to keep Curves International properly informed and I asked them for advice on the best way to proceed…The one thing they did spell out, there is no “standard” $10,000 fee. At least Not Anymore. They said, if I write a letter asking for a settlement instead of paying all the outstanding royalties and ad fees, then they will put it to a review board and the review board will make a suggestion for a settlement. Then they told me not to write a letter but to hold onto the closing packet.
Well, then they forgot about me for 6 or 8 or 10 weeks. I think it was sometime in May that I got a notice that I owed some $40,000 for the balance of royalties and such…
however, i did inform them that i was filing for bankruptcy. they never asked for the bankruptcy attorneys name or the case number. i am just now filing, so they havent gotten any legal notices yet either.
since then I have not heard one word. it’s been what, 7 months since I closed. ridiculous…
i do have another franchise, that i’m struggling to hold onto, and you would think maybe that’s why they’re giving me some slack…
they are very frustrating but i think they have a backlog of closed cases. i have been told by others (gossip?) that they are understaffed and overworked. of course they’re busy with the big lawsuit that “unhappy” is part of it. and all the little lawsuits. i would like to know more about gofigure’s lawsuit against them too.
my attorney told me not to worry about any of it, because our state law supercedes whatever was written in the franchise agreement….
Donna Submitted on 2009/10/12 at 12:21pm
Robert was right on. Settlement from 10,000 now wanting 2,500. And its only been 12 days. I don’t close until Oct. 30th. They were also nice and I wouldn’t have to pay it until the end of Nov. I wonder If I ask nice they’ll say i don’t have to give away my equipment to another Curves or destroy it -I can do what I want with it. What do you think?
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[...] CURVES: Negotiating the $10,000 Closing Fee [...]
As for these “failure fees” that are hidden in the unilateral, unbargained contracts, you can see from the above that they are negotiable.
Do you think Curves will actually sue you for $10,000 if you can show the court that you are unable to operate your business without sustaining a loss? Do the Courts uphold these abstruse contract terms that obscurely define the failure of the franchisee as an opportunity for the franchisor to get a fee from the loser?
I don’t think the Courts would go this far but I am not an attorney. The Courts do always appear to support the franchisors and their contract terms, but would they support such unfair terms now that “franchise fraud” and the economy are worsening the situation for franchisees —and now that the abstruse franchise failure fee is getting coverage on the Internet —and Curves are closing down all over the place.
In hindsight, I can see that we could have saved ourselves a lot of money if we had just closed down our The UPS Store and taken our chances with the court, when UPS threatened to demand liquidated damages from us because we failed to thrive and were trying to terminate the relationship. We stupidly lost even more money when they insisted that we get an attorney to bargain the “failure fee” and the termination with their outside attorney.
Please know that the franchisor is free to negotiate the terms of the contract with you and maybe you, yourself, can negotiate your “failure fee” down to one penny! Think about this! If you just close down and do nothing and see what happens, maybe nothing will happen and you will save yourself the price of an attorney at $200 per hour. But, do comply with all the paperwork involved in termination as described in the actual contract to the best of your ability to demonstrate your good faith in the termination of the business.
Good luck!
Tammy on October 14th, 2009 7:37 am
I have a club in Missouri and I know how you feel. I also hate to dissapoint my members. I work a 2nd job and my husband too. I need help with Curves. What can we do? HELP
Curves will sue in hopes that you are already broke enough that you can not afford to hire an Attorney in Texas and fly there for the case…they win by default. They know that the Courts will not be sided with CI in the majority of those suits.
I too am planning on closing oct. 30, 2009. Has anyone sold their equipment to help pay off debts and how much did you ask for each piece.
Thanks Penny .
To Tammy and Penny send an email to unhappyfranchisee@gmail.com [email corrected] requesting it to be forwarded to Robert Lay and he will be able to help give you some advice. Be sure to include your phone number.
I feel real sympathy for those Curves Owners who have to close down because I remember the terrible days when we realized that we had to close down our The UPS Store to avoid losing even more money each month —-and the terrible realization that we had lost our entire investment.
I know that those who are faced with this terrible stress and strain and the realities of losing your entire investment in the business are in pain and don’t know what to do and who to turn to.
Some of you will be able to avoid personal bankruptcy but perhaps will have to continue to pay on any startup debt you assumed and personally guaranteed with personal assets. Some of you will have lease obligations that mean even more debt if the Landlord gets a judgment against you for a lease that has b een personally guaranteed. Some of you will perhaps not be able to avoid personal bankruptcy and if this is the case, don’t keep digging the hole deeper. As Richard Solomon, Attorney and Author advises on Blue Mau Mau —–Do it! and quickly! and get on with your life, and out from under the stress of the indecision.
Those who have to quit to cut their losses when they have exhausted their startup capital and exceeded the startup estimates of the franchisor, etc.. do believe they have been defrauded in the sales process by misrepresentations and omissions. When these tired and angry franchisees survive with any personal financial assets still available, they often think of joining class action and mass action lawsuits to seek justice and restitution.
I am not opposed to these lawsuits because they do push the courts to look at the fraud that is going on in franchising, but I believe that failed franchisees need to be objective and not subjective and look at the status quo of the law and regulation surrounding franchising that has contributed to their current situation.
This is why I post —to warn —and to try to provide the benefit of my research to current and past franchisees.
Please see http://thegreatfranchisingrobbery.blogspot.com/ and read in a Google Search, the articles “Franchise Regulation Realities — Deception or Patriotism” – “Disadvantage of Buying a New Franchise for Prospective Franchisee” and “The Franchise Disclosure Document –Beware of Red Herring”
Unhappy:
You gave the wrong email address, but I corrected it.
Please use the email address unhappyfranchisee@gmail.com if you’d like a message forwarded to Mr. Lay.
Thanks
Sorry about that I must have been in a hurry or maybe it’s that I’m loosing my mind . take your pick.. Any way thanks again Unhappy who is getting happier every day
Penny…yes we sold evrything to include the Smart equipment to pay off as much debt as we could. Look to your local Clubs first to see if they are in need of any equipment then ask your members. Many of them will also buy their favorite stations and work out at home.
Sorry to hear you need to close but understand…life will go on and we will be back on our feet with time.
We owned 4 Curves. Lucky for us we sold 2 for good bucks a couple of years ago, closed 1, and kept the 4th, our flagship cash cow.
If you have to close, ignore the agressive posturing by CI. We negotiated the
10,000. down to a $100. monthly payment, which they agreed to and then came back and said they could not accept a monthly payment. We offerred $1200. which they took.
Listen, the people you are dealing with at CI are low level clerks, that sit at computer screens and answer the phone. Stand strong, tell them what you can or will pay, and never show weakness.
If you need to, buy a good book on business negotiation.
At club camp in 2002, I understood Howie’s true intent when he said,
“money is God’s way of telling me that I am doing the right thing”
Its a shame, because Curves is a brilliant concept..
.
You are right that Curves is a brilliant concept but it will go bankrupt as long as Howie is running it. He is nothing but a greedy crook who will get what is coming to him once everyone who has filed suit against him gets to court. The only thing they want you to sign when you close is a so called mutual release form which only protects them. They will drop the fee down to around 2500 dollars now but you must sign the release form, by doing so you are signing away your option of filing a lawsuit against them but they can still sue you. For all means don’t sign anything if you happen to close. Send an email to Sean at this site requesting him to forward it to me and include your phone number and I will let you know what to do and what to expect.
Just received a notice from the post ofice for our facility. I haven’t picked it up yet. Will this week as it came on Saturday. Probably a packet from the “born again christian”. We have been closed for 3 months now. In the past 9 months, I have asked for help with someone coming in to the facility to make it better, no response. then mentioned that we may have to close as we are not “making it”. No response. Again, after two weeks asked for some help with someone coming in to our facilty. Oh…. we have had 4 area directors in the past 2 years. What is up with that. And I have only seen 1 area director in 9 years. Got some poor southern bell on the phone that would not talk to me as I was a bit upset and she said they don’t deal with unhappy franchise owners. I even asked to speak with “Mr. Born Again”. Was put on hold, thought I would even be able to talk to him. Nope. Told that he was gone for the day. This is so typical. I hope he gets what he deserves and maybe he should “be born again”. I hope his upbringing is a bit more admirable.
Lola, don’t sign anything until you talk to me. Send an email to Sean at this site and include your phone number and ask it to be forwarded to me and I will call you immediately.
Hi, all.
I commented back in January or February about closing my club. I did close and I will say that I did my best to comply with any of the closing obligations that I could. The $10,000 was not an option for us. CI did work with us and I closed without any threats or ugliness. We are in debt and will be for about 3.5 more years, but I have peace of mind for the first time in 3 years and for that I am very grateful.
Penny, Tammy, Donna, my heart just goes out to you when I read your comments. Don’t continue trying to keep a failing club open. Get out and move on with your life. It is not worth it and you will be so relieved when it’s all over.
I, too, loved my members and still keep in contact with many of them. There were no hard feelings or anger at my closing. They knew I tried my best. That is all any of us can do. I do not have time for anger or bitterness. I’m just thankful that I have a good job and that we are doing okay.
I wish those of you involved in the lawsuit the very best of luck.
Denise
Good luck to you Denise and God Bless. Thanks for posting
We closed on October 16, 2009 and followed all the instructions in the closing packet. We sent several emails pleading our case as to why we couldn’t pay the $10k and continued to request that they accept $2500. I don’t know why but they held firm at $5000 which we just don’t have so after their deadline passed, they told us it was being turned over to legal. I was surprised at how quickly they acted with us because we got their demand letter last week. I have done nothing and need to hear from anyone else who is sitting on pins and needles just in a holding pattern.
We just closed our club on Dec. 31st and received the closing procedures today via email. Should we not complete the forms if we can’t be in compliance with anything – we don’t have money to have our sign removed, pay back members or pay Curves. We donated our equipment but not to a prison.
What happens if you don’t complete the forms? What happens if you don’t pick up the demand letter that Sherry mentions above?
What happens if they get a judgment against you in the Waco Court?
Thanks – I’d appreciate hearing from someone who can give us some advice now.
Pat! I am not an attorney but I understand that consulting with an attorney costs money and those who close down their businesses don’t have the money, generally, to consult with an attorney. It is my opinion that the attorneys can’t do much for you in view of the contract terms you agreed to when you put your signature to the contract agreement but honest attorneys will tell you the pros and cons of cooperating or not cooperating with the demand of “liquidated damages” from the franchisor when you fail to thrive and close your business.
If you try to cooperate in the closing of your business to do the least damage to your franchisor and his image, this should help you in the event they do try to get a judgement against you from a court. If you try to be as fair as you can be and follow the Golden Rule with your clients, as well, this will demonstrate your good faith in closing down your business because of insolvency or to avoid insolvency in the future.
I’m not clear on whether or not Curves have tried to get judgements from the courts for the “failure fee” when businesses close down because of failure to thrive. Since they are offering to settle, it would appear that they haven’t been spending the money to go to court to enforce these terms of their contract. Would the $10,000 or a $5,000 be a small claim in your state?
You can look at the Statutes of your State and see how long judgments are good for. I wouldn’t think that the courts would uphold these ugly terms, the failure fee, in these hard times if you can prove to the Court that you were losing money and were closing to avoid insolvency, and I think Curves knows this to be true.
On the other hand, if you just closed because you weren’t making profits and weren’t in danger of failing, the courts would probably uphold the terms of the damages for closing your business before the expiration of the time term of the contract. Obviously, the purpose of the “failure fee” to begin with is to keep franchisees standing as long as possible to feed the franchisor with gross sales and to gain an advantage when the franchisee fails.
Profits for the franchisees are not promised in the routine franchise agreement. In other words you just can’t quit because you aren’t making profits but if you have to quit to avoid insolvency in the future and have exhausted the estimated startup costs, etc.. and are still losing money, how could the courts uphold these “failure fees?”
These failure fees are especially unfair and unjust when the franchise is sold under cover of regulation as if there is very little risk to the buyers, and I’m sure the courts know what is going on.
Remember that “doing nothing” and “waiting” while trying to follow the Golden Rule is a decision in itself and sometimes the best decision.
Good luck to you!
Carol
http://thegreatfranchisingrobbery.com
Pat,
I have helped many owners go through this and you need to send Sean an email requesting it be forwarded to me with your phone number on it and I will get a hold of you asap. Carol as she stated is not a lawyer and has no idea of what is going on with all the Curves lawsuits or how to handle the closing packet you received. Do not sign anything that you receive from curves until you talk to me.
I have heard that CI has quite trying to charge the closing fee as they now are aware that it is illegal in TX to charge it. can any one confirm this? i also heard that it is illegal for CI to collect franchise fees and add fees once you are closed in TX. Is this true? man what a bunch of low life crooks they are nothing but scumbags
After all the threats and suits CI agreed to take $3,000, which i am now sorry i paid. We have not received the release which was promised, and will head to personal bankruptcy to avoid future claims. DO NOT send them money. As everyone else here has stated I had a thriving club that had to close due to the economy and rent over 40% of income.
After reading all of the terrible things CI has done to other closing clubs I closed on 10-30-o9. I did not tell them anything I just closed my back account. Gave my members a 3 week notice I did not draft any more money, sold my equipment for almost nothing just to pay my employees back pay. I was mentally and physically zapped and broke. We will be filing personal backruptcy this week. Can anyone tell me if that will end the Curves NIGHT MARE!!!! Curves has not come after me yet, but my leasing company is sueing me for breaking my lease and my credit care deibt has gotten out of control.
Penny: Your Bankruptcy Attorney will answer all of your questions for you. In the bankruptcy, if you have any assets that will be liquidated, the Landlord will be first in line with his judgment as a creditor, if he does get a judgement against you. I believe I read where Landlords are high up on the list of creditors in bankruptcy since franchising has exploded in our economy. Just inform your Landlord that you are declaring bankruptcy and refer him to your bankruptcy attorney.
I’m sorry for your pain! You are a good person! You did your best to take care of your obligations and now you will start on your path to put this behind you. Some day, you will look back and it won’t hurt as much.
When you feel better, please call your State Attorney General and your elected representatives and write a complaint to the Federal Trade Commission on their Website if you feel that you were sold an “unviable” business concept and that the “risk” of the investment was withheld from you in the sales process. Maybe, if enough Curves owners and other franchisees complain, the government will try to make franchising safer for new buyers of franchises.
Good Luck and God Bless!
Carol
http://thegreatfranchisingrobbery.blogspot.com
Hi I just closed one of my three locations and Curves did try and sue me for royalties and closing fees….we settled at 10 thou case closed now they want me to donate the equiptement…….I have two other locations and I need to close them also can anybody help…I am drowning…..
tammy,
You do not own them anything and for heaven sakes don’t pay them a dime. send an email to unhappyfranchisee[at]gmail.com at this web site and I will call you an explain what you have to do>
Hi
Looking for some answers. My contract is up on Aug. 19, 2010. I’m so happy!!! I’ve been hanging on by a thread. I e-mail CI and ask them If i had to sign another contract they said yes a two year one I told them no I would like to do a year or less because of the ecomony. I have a year left on my lease and 50k in debt If I do close my doors. Idea Can I close in Aug remove everything that has curves on it and reopen under my own gym? Their equipment does not have curves on it.
trying to stay afloat.
God Bless,
Lonnie
Lonnie,
please send admin at unhappyfranchisee@gmail.com an email with your phone number and he will forward it to me and I will contact you and go over what some owners are doing. The email address is unhappyfranchisee@gmail.com
Thanks ,
unhappy
Lonnie,
That is what i would like to know as well
next step,
refer to the post just above yours and I’ll be glad to fill you in on how and what to do.
TO ALL OWNERS WHO HAVE PAID A PORTION OR ALL OF THE 10,000 CLOSING FEE. HOWIE HAS USED EXTORTION TO COLLECT THOSE FUNDS ILLEGALLY FROM YOU AND YOU NEED TO DEMAND THAT CI REFUND YOUR MONEY BACK ASAP. IF YOU HAVE QUESTIONS ABOUT THIS SEND AN EMAIL TO UNHAPPYFRANCHISEE[DOT]COM AT THIS SITE AND HE WILL FORWARD IT TO ME INCLUDE YOUR PHONE NUMBER AND I WILL CALL YOU ASAP.
I see nothing in the franchise agreement regarding any penalty for closing a club. Without a specific contractual obligation, what is the source of the penalty?
Tara,
you are correct there is not a word in the franchise agreement about a closing fee. Howie started trying to intimidate owners in to paying this and has used extortion to make owners pay this ridicules fee by telling owners they will be sent to the legal department if they don’t comply and could be sued for the remaining franchise and advertising fee’s that are outstanding on the contract. the key to this is that they say could but they know at CI that they can’t win those cases as once you close you do not owe franchise or advertising fee’s The notices from CI now come from the resale department. What a joke and a fraud. How law will Howie go?
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Good day! I want to ask you, which means prizakrytii repay customers. Return the unused months of service or return fee?
Andres,
could you repeat your question…….
New Curves post about the Niagra Falls club closure and CI’s standard reaction:
CURVES: Should Failed Franchises be Resold?
Comments, insights & opinions appreciated.
I want to close the club, I have to date not many customers and no debts to the landlord. But I am afraid that if I leave him, you can simply sink into debt, which brings it. My question is what it means to pay members? I understand that I must return the money to people who do not use their time for study. How does it all and why should I start?The following month, I have no money, even if it would be something I do not want them to pay for content that brings your debts. Should I return the fee for the registration of corporate and individual customers in the club or not?
Andres,
Where is your club? Is it in the US?
Could this be the complete destruction of Curves. Read this:
http://www.nixonpeabody.com/publications_detail3.asp?ID=3226
Good day! Yesterday I spoke with the representative curves in my country. I have started to intimidate lawyers, if I closed it and royalty payments for 9 years. But I have no more money that would contain the club. In response to the crisis, we can not sustain the costs that brings the business. I have a very strong desire to close this business as quickly as possible. What should I do? Can they have a claim to my personal property?
Andres,
I would love to help you but you need to download skypes to your computer so we can talk. It is free and the calls are free also. What country are you from? Please send the administration an email requesting it to be sent to me with your email address and phone and I will contact you asap. Send your email to; admin at unhappyfranchisee@gmail.com
Good day! My wife and I will soon go mad from what is happening to us. We fear we think that will happen when we close the club. We do not have 10 000 or $ 6000. And yet more than 40 000 dollars. We are afraid that they will qualify for our unique apartment. We ask you for help, how can we defend against them. What we do?
Andres
Calm down you will be ok I promise you everything will work out you just need to have faith and follow my above post. You have a computer type in skype and download it . It is free and email me asap and we can help you get through this. Again what country are you from?
Good day! Who closed his club and paid 40 000 dollars for the coming contributions. We are in the process of closing. But our club is not in the U.S. and that they could have done? Tell us about your experience
Good evening! Many times I asked you for advice and assistance. Maybe this is a happy frnachazer of curves and simply collects the information here.
Andres, we have tried to help you but you won’t respond to our posts. Do You have skype if not download it and I will call you. where are you from? Do you ?understand English Reread our responses to you posts and send me an email by sending one to the admin of this site.
Many times I sent to you by e-mail is my nickname to Skype and we have a lot of time waiting for your call.
Send me your username I’ll find you in the Skype
I have never received your email so for the last time send your email to; admin at unhappyfranchisee@gmail.com and ask him to forward it to me. I will contact you when I receive your email. I will than send you my skype user-name.
I sent many messages to the address you gave me. We need real help. We are in a very bad situation.
We will be waiting for your call, because it is important for us
Hello again. We waited all night for your call. They sent a lot of messages on the address you gave us. What do we do? On Monday, we want to send a statement to close the club. Our lawyers say, to the personal property will not come.
Hi,
I opened my club in June 2009 in Istanbul, Turkey and for the first few months my club seemed like it would be doing well but by November my membership numbers dropped to 0!!! At the time of my opening my club there were 5 Curves clubs in my city and now there is only 1 left; all the others had to close down including mine…I have been chasing CI since beginning of December, telling them I was having a tough time and that I would most likely end up having to close down. I haven’t been contacted by anyone offering any support, guidance or help so in the end I gave up trying and had to close down in March.
Funny enough 4 months after my various emails I receive an email from their re-sale department telling me; and I quote, that so-and-so from Curves tried contacting me various times but was unsuccessful in her attempts reaching me…total load of crap! yes there was a lady at re-sale who emailed me and said she would contact but never ever did even though I chased her many times! So I reply back asking for proof as to when and how they tried to reach me as per their claims and the answer was ‘sorry for your frustration but we promise that we will be in contact from now on.now tell us are you still open or closed?’ and I told them that after 4 months I couldn’t afford to wait for them to come back to me any longer and eventually I did have to close down…
Now they sent me an email, using a very intimidating tone of voice as I expected of course, and told me that I abandoned my club which is a breach of contract ( A.K.A THE CARDINAL SIN – OH FOR GOD’S SAKE, GIVE ME A BREAK!) and that I owe them all the future royalty fees as well as the advertising fees, which come to a total of around 40K Dollars…Hahahahaaaa, really funny! I cannot believe that they actually have the nerves to ask me for the future advertising fees as CI have been telling all the Curves clubs in my country from the beginning that there would be no advertising done (whether local or national) in Turkey because there just wasn’t enough number of clubs to support just yet; so each club had to pay for their own advertising until now. It’s obvious that those half-wits that send franchisees like me those scary-sounding-emails have a template email that they copy and paste and they are not even smart enough to check their policies for individual countries.
Anyways, I will not pay them a single penny and don’t care how many silly emails they will send me. It already cost me 150K Dollars so far and I had to sell my flat to pay off my loans to the bank. It makes me sick to think of the amount of money I threw away, we have a 7 month-old-baby and my husband, quite rightly, says that it could be her life-time education money had I not got into this business; how very stupid of me! I don’t even want to think about it because it makes me want to literally throw up!
Does anyone know if they can sue me in Turkey? I know they claim that it was breach of contract from my part but I have been reading the contract thoroughly and it appears that the franchisee does infact have the right to terminate the agreement should CI not support them, offer them advise etc etc and I wonder if I would be OK to go down that route and refuse any payment
I do feel for everyone that went/goes through the same nightmare but lets all look at the bright side; at least we’ve been there, done that : )))
I forgot to mention that on their last email, they sent 2 forms for me to fill in, sign and send back within 2 working days (why 2 working days, God knows!) : Club worksheet and Intend to Close Facility Form. But I won’t send them back until I am 100% sure that they OK to sign and send back. What did the other franchisees here do?
Hi Elif! We are very sympathetic to your situation, since we are on the verge of closing and will close soon. We understand you, because we’ve been in your situation, but thank God that we do not have credits. The American dream of own business – it is simply a lie. Real business is not yours, it is the business of the Americans and the master franchise in your country. And we were told about the successful business that can bring from 3000 euros per month and more. We were deceived, just like everyone. The courses we were in Spain, and we noticed that the people who have this is very sad and worried, but people who just bought a carefree and joyful. We are still very surprised at this. But now we know it. The fact that we have sold – this monster, who is infinitely drink and drink your blood. And without it, he’s dead. Thank God that we will soon be able to kill him. Two documents that you sent a waiver of the right to apply to the court to protect your rights and your commitment that you must bring the gym where they would go. Did not sign these papers. We told our closing, but we were told that they were very disappointed and examine the situation of our club. It’s all excuses. I know that I will send 42,000 dollars for royalties. But I will not pay a single dollar for what I sold. I want to sue them and get all the money we spent back, believe that such a possibility. Soon, this infection will be in Poland and the Czech Republic. Poor people who buy it or have already bought. I suggest you join, find more people in Europe and your country, that would speak with the requirements for the return of our money and pecuniary damage. After years of work with this nightmare, I hate this company and want what they can as quickly went bankrupt. We would like to talk with you closer and understand each other as the victims of the curves. How can we contact you? Write to us and we’ll find a way to communicate. Locate your fellow countrymen who have suffered from this plague.
Hi Elif,
So sad to hear about your problems with curves but as you can see your not alone. Don’t let them intimidate you and don’t send them any money or sign anything that they may send you. They are nothing but crooks!!!!!!!!
Hi everyone! Dear users of the forum. We suggest you create an association to assist victims of Curves in Europe. I think that such people there are very many. We were beaten by one and we all remain silent and fight themselves as best we can with this monster. I have read that only in Istanbul was closed four of the club. And everyone is silent, but these crooks they write what they want 42,000 dollars. They brought us to poverty, all while we are silent. As long as we keep quiet we will beat, beat and beat. Waiting for your suggestions by email
Hello all. My Curves is in the verge of closing as well. We bought it resale 3 years ago. It was good at first, but now it is in RED figures, cannot sustain itself any longer. I have several questions: I incorporated, so all paperwork is through the corporation, how does this affect the closure if I just disolve my corporation? Anyone has any feedback on this? Also, I got the curvessmart equipment, but instead of buying it outright, I leased it, how will that work as far as selling the equipment, am I entitled to do that? Any feedback very appreciated? Thank you very much and hope all of us find peace and forget it all ever happend after is all done!!
Andres,
Your idea of an association for UK clubs for support is an excellent one. We can do that right here. Spread the word to all the owners over seas to come and [post here and we will give them all the advice and support they need.
Abraham,
When you signed the franchise agreement you singed it with a personal signature so according to curves you are liable not the corporation. You leased the smart equipment on a plan where you would own it after your payments were done. It is your equipment once you close but you may have to take the smart off and send it back to the lease holder.
Hello friends affected by the one-eyed!
I’m not talking only about the UK. These clubs have appeared recently in Turkey and in Ukraine and Bulgaria and Romania. Soon there will be in Poland and the Czech Republic. If you look at the statistics for closure – that Turkey closed only 4 clubs in Istanbul. Now people began to intimidation and to demand 42,000 dollars, after ruining them. You can read the story of a girl from Turkey, she had to sell his apartment, that would settle the debts, which were made during the work. Our club has existed for only 6 months. We have 3 months he started to bring to 1500 euro loss in 4 month loss amounted to 2000 euro, for 5 months we decided to close the club. We reported this to the main office of curves. Contact us representative in our country and threatened to pay royalties for 10 years of the contract, the courts and lawyers. I think that once held 60 days from the date of application, we will begin to receive emails from the curves with death threats, and documents that will say that we renounce the right to file them in court. We will not sign anything and intend to defend. The contract we signed the first from individuals, and then sign a document transferring the rights to the franchise company. We can all join together and sue the joint action by competent persons. We are all devastated and we must unite to cut costs all of us at the Bar. I think that in the UK, the contract also says that the dispute shall be settled by the Arbitration Court under the laws of England Wales. Waiting for your reply, I think that we can create together and fight these fraudsters. I heard that the curves are bankrupt, but it’s hidden.
Think about all of this.
Andres,
Keep spreading the word about the site as that way we can hopefully prevent this from happening to other good people. Good luck and god bless
Andres and Unhappy, thanks for your encouraging emails : )
Andres, I am so sorry to hear about your sitation too. What country are you from? Are you from Bulgaria? [del]
Like I said, I am not sending them any money or signing any documents! They told me I had 2 days to sign them and that if I didn’t they would pass my case to their legal department. They seem to think that by using words like ‘ our legal department’ they are going to scare me off and that I will obbey their orders. It’s so obvious that by telling me that I only have 2 days, they want to make sure that I don’t have enough time to seek legal advise on the consquences of signing those papers and that I will simply panick and do what they want!
So here is what I did this afternoon; I sent them an email pointing out the following;
- I asked them to tell me where in the contract it stated that I had to respond their inquiries within 2 days
- I copied and pasted all the emails I sent to Curves where I was asking for guidance and advice in the past when I was having problems and was worried about closing down
- I asked them to explain why I never received any meaningful respons from them until such time that my club was eventually forced to close down
- I told them that my current situation was a direct result of serious negligence from CFW side and that they didn’t fulfill their responsibilities that were outlined under certain sections of the franchise agreement
- Alsofrom last year they owed me some money (around 1,100 USD) due to some shipment error they made when they were delievering my equipment . I was promised (by email) that they would reimburse me when I sent them the receipts. So today, I also told them that I would be posting the receipts on Monday and asked them to make the payment within one month!
It’s true that there are 4 clubs that closed down in Istanbul since last June. One of them is mine, the other 2 belonged to non-Turkish citizens (I think they are Americans actually) who lived in the US and from what I heard from their former manager they ended up paying CFW some settlement money after they closed. The 4th club belonged to another Turkish lady like me, she said that on paper she still owed them a lot of money
I forgot to mention that I also told them that I would be consulting my lawyers if needs be
Make sure to tell the other Turkish lady about this site and not to pay Curves and Howie anything not one dime. Keep up the good work and don’t let them intimidate you as it is a form of extortion. Howie is nothing but a crook and so is his wife Diane. I can’t help but wonder how they sleep at night. They are sociopaths.
they must be counting sheep dressed up in USD customes : )
Do not give them NOT ONE PENNY
Elif,
That was a good one and brought a smile on my face. Thanks for the humor I need that.
Andres.
That’s right not one cent more !!!! You know the old saying sucker, me once shame on you , sucker me twice shame on me.
“You know the old saying sucker, me once shame on you , sucker me twice shame on me.”
Funny I was just thinking about that quote in relation to franchisees who were too stupid/cheap to hire a lawyer before buying a franchise, then compounding their problems by being too stupid/broke to hire a lawyer now that they’re failing… and listening to anonymous internet commenters instead.
You can’t get out of a problem using the same thinking that got you into it.
Andre:
Someone should tell you that what you are posting is ridiculous in English. Some of it’s funny. Some of it’s bizarre. Lots of it makes no sense. Here are a few:
“60 days from the date of application, we will begin to receive emails from the curves with death threats” Seriously? Death threats?
“I understand that I must return the money to people who do not use their time for study.”
“I have started to intimidate lawyers”
“As long as we keep quiet we will beat, beat and beat.”
“Contact us representative in our country and threatened to pay royalties for 10 years of the contract, the courts and lawyers.”
“Hello friends affected by the one-eyed!”
Andre, you really should have someone translate your comments before posting.
Andre,
Don’t let this guest upset you it is probably jd or someone like him so just disregard his posts. If they can’t understand what you are saying let them go elsewhere. We appreciate your posts and understand that English is not your native language.
I understand that my English is very funny, because it is not my family and at school I was teaching another foreign language. Maybe some of the phrases sound funny and absurd, but who had curves, I think a few more months will be to think in full of porridge in your head, spilling all their emotions and devastation that remains from this nightmare. Yes, we are remaining with no money, but we were left alone at one of our children and we are all healthy and happy that we will no longer curves. And about the association and the curve of the confrontation, it is a good idea. No country in the world in which a person buys it, was not injured and did not survive the pain. We dllzhny all know if we are together we have power, but to single them we will blackmail, intimidate.
Andre: unhappy will encourage anything that’s negative about Curves but trust me your English is not understandable.
When you say “I have started to intimidate lawyers” that means that you are threatening and instilling fear in lawyers.
When you say you “receive emails from the curves with death threats” that means that Curves is literally threatening to kill you. Is that true?
““As long as we keep quiet we will beat, beat and beat.” Is really too crude to explain.
“threatened to pay royalties for 10 years” means they threatened to pay you money. If so, take it!
““Hello friends affected by the one-eyed!” means nothing except maybe a cyclops reference or an insult to the physically disabled.
As the forum is in English, you should probably get an English speaker to post for you. That may keep you from getting sued for accusing the company of attempted murder and intimidating lawyers!
Andre,
You are so right we do have strength in numbers and don’t let any fool try to intimidate you into not posting on this site. Get the word out about Curves so other individuals won’t make the same mistake so many other have by trusting Howie” the sociopath “
“guest”
How many languages do YOU speak?
How can you assume that because someone is not as fluent in his second or perhaps third language as the native tongue that he is stupid?
And just what country were you referring in the use of “third world country” Turkey?? Then you also require a few lessons in global studies.
You may have made some good points, but lost all credibility when you attacked someone and demonstrated your bigoted ignorance.
You sound much like Howie with his egotistical stances. I think perhaps you are a Howie plant and were just attempting to shift the blame from him to anyone else.
I believe Andre, like many Curves owners, entered into the agreement in good faith at least. -Unlike Howie who knows better and focuses on deception , lies, and intimidation.
And who gave you the right to regulate who posts here?
Frazzled,
Thank you for putting your words of wisdom in on this as those types of post make me so upset I would like to well I better not say but you get the impression I’m sure. I have personally talked to Andre and he is a honest and decent human being and I for one am proud that he has taken the time to try to post his story and opinion here.
So again thanks and God Bless you and your family!!!!!!!
frazzled:
Too bad this website doesn’t give an award for how many incorrect statements one can make in a single comment, cuz you’d be a sure winner!
“who gave you the right to regulate who posts here?” Reread my comments and you’ll see I suggested Andre have an English speaker help him with his comments before posting. My suggestion was meant to help him participate more meaningfully, not to stop posting. Perhaps someone can help you comprehend English.
“just what country were you referring in the use of “third world country” Turkey??”
Andre never said he was from Turkey, just an Eastern European country. Elf guessed Bulgaria but Andre never answered.
“You…lost all credibility when you attacked someone and demonstrated your bigoted ignorance.”
I never attacked Andre, merely informed him he was posting gibberish. That’s kind, not bigoted nor ignorant. So, wrong again.
“I think perhaps you are a Howie plant”
I understand he goes by the name of Gary. Is “Howie” supposed to be derogatory? How old are you? And no, I’m 100% mammalian, not a plant.
Andre wrote: “I see that this plague dbiraetsya in all countries….Now it poyavmlos Bulgaria Romania Ukraine Kazakhstan, people want more shopping-muck in Poland.”
Andre wrote “… in our country, this product is generally sold illegally…. The contract that we signed has no legal effect, for many reasons But it’s all null and void or in America nor in our country. So what else can I arrange an international scandal, most likely will do that, that would be me my money back and told all the owners in my country that they can make a shit.
Perhaps frazzled and unhappy can explain to me the meaning of “plague dbiraetsya,” why people want “shopping-muck in Poland” and why franchisees were told to “make a shit”?
I think it’s cruel to let the guy waste his time posting nonsense (albeit humorous) without so much as telling him.
And, by the way, I only speak English… which is why I’m not posting on Eastern European blogs.
Frazzled,
I think you hit it right on the head guest is probably a plant from Howie but in either case we have found that people like that should just be ignored, not responded to and eventually they will act like they are, a fart and blow in the wind!!! don’t even waste your time responding to the obvious bigoted and ignorant a hole. Obviously this is a free site and who ever it maybe can post here but if we just ignore their posts in time they all just act like cow pies that they are and hit the trail. Even when they try to get you to respond by asking idiotic questions or make outlandish stupid statements just don’t respond. There not worth the time or effort Hell I don’t even bother to read their posts anymore they are so pathetic it is sick that they are so lonely that they have to come here to post .
Hello friends!
I want to thank you for your understanding. It does not matter from which country we see the color of our skin, what languages we speak and in what country we live. This does not prevent us from being together and unite against these fraudsters. We read here the terrible story of the girl from Turkey, which can not now make ends meet. My history a little better, but still very sad. We all need to be strong and resist them. It can not scare us. I want to sue the company and get their money back. I found lawyers who deal with franchises. Who wants to can join us. Nick Guest – this is most likely from the curves, which examines and elicits who, when and where is going to close. I receive many letters and the only question being asked where you live and when you are locked, so be careful that they would not have been able to hinder you to accomplish everything you want
Andre:
What do you mean when you write: “… in our country, this product is generally sold illegally…. The contract that we signed has no legal effect, for many reasons But it’s all null and void or in America nor in our country.”
Did you actually purchase directly from Curves or a broker or master franchise in your country? How was it sold illegally and why is your contract invalid? Who would you sue?
I don’t care which country you’re in, but it’s not clear who you bought from, why it’s illegal and who you think wronged you.
Andre,
Don’t even respond to guest as it just encourages them to make stupid, ridiculous posts and it’s obvious from previous post that they are a shill for Howie. Most of us here have had to put up with nut cases like this one in the past and have found that if we just ignore them they fade away and go to some other board and try to stir up trouble. They obviously have never had a curves franchise and for that matter never had the balls to be in business for themselves Unfortunately, Andre, many people in the US are crack pots and just try to stir up the masses even though they have no idea what actual curves owners have had to endure with Howie’s sociopath ways. Tell your lawyers our lawyers in the States would love to work with them in bringing this crook to justice and would be more than happy to talk to them concerning how to deal with this unethical, immoral, and crooked CEO, Howie.
“Don’t even respond to guest… if we just ignore them they fade away and go to some other board”
unhappy… is this your website? Are you the moderator or just another commenter – like me? Where exactly did you get the authority to decide whose opinion counts and who should be ignored? Shall we ask the moderator whether you have this kind of authority?
This is obviously an open forum where both sides are welcome to voice their views. What I have posted is both logical and constructive (It is you not I who reverts to name calling and fart jokes). You have already said you don’t read opposing views, which is why you mischaracterize my points.
I believe that unhappy is reckless in that he likes to play lawyer yet does not have the education nor an iota of experience in law. He speaks as an authority and advises others but has no track record of successfully dealing with Curves. He is engaged in litigation with CI and lost his clubs – that does not make him an authority. His personal ire against the founder clouds his judgement and he demeans anyone who offers an alternative viewpoint as a shill.
Believe me, if I were a shill I would be encouraging you to listen to the ramblings of unhappy rather than seeking real legal counsel from an actual attorney.
BREAKING NEW ALL CURVES OWNERS NEED TO BE AWARE OF………
It has become obvious that the owners who have bonded through this site and have taken the time to file complaints against Curves International and Howie for the intimidating , unethical and immoral business tactics they use on Curves owners is having a major impact on many states who have passed statutes which may supersede the Franchise Agreement between owners and Curves International in the area of termination and renewal of owners franchises as well as states that limit Curves International ability to restrict owners activity after the Franchise Agreement has ended. Here is a list of those states.
Arkansas, California, Connecticut, Delaware, Hawaii, Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Michigan, Minnesota, Mississippi, New Jersey, South Dakota, Virgina, Washington, Wisconsin, Florida, Montana, Oklahoma, and North Dakota.
Curves owners in those states that have been intimidated into paying fees for closing, that have been charged excessive transfer fees, or threatened with legal action for closing need to contact franchise lawyers in their states to see what remedies are available to them.
In the near future we will be starting a new campaign to shed light on the atrocities that are being done to Curves owners by Howie so stay tuned.
By curves owners working together to send a strong message to Howie we are helping to make sure that one million women continue to get stronger.
unhappy says “It has become obvious that the owners who have bonded through this site… [are] having a major impact on many states who have passed statutes which may supersede the Franchise Agreement between owners and Curves International…”
Can you substantiate this statement by naming one state that has passed a statute superseding the Curves franchise agreement as a direct result of those who have bonded through this site?
unhappy says ““there are plenty of lawyers that are taking these cases on a contingency where we don’t have to pay a dime in legal fees”
We are still waiting for a list of lawyers who are taking Curves owners cases on straight contingency. Just 3 will suffice.
[Beware of people who make statements as facts but ignore requests for substantiation. There are a lot of opinions here being dressed up as facts.]
Here are some interesting facts on some polls that were taken from actual Curves owners. The results are very interesting and quite telling on weather a Curves is a good investment .
Have you considered selling your Curves? A whopping 90% said yes
If any owners are actually making money? 60 % of owners said no
This question should be a real eye opener to you as well as Howie ……….. Do you plan on renewing your franchise agreement? A whopping 86% said NO
Are you making money from your Curves income? 75% said no
I don’t see the point of classifying any country as a 3rd world one on the basis of one’s limited standarts. I am the girl from Turkey (it’s Elif by the was not Elf) and to be frank, and excuse my french, don’t give a monkeys to such bigoted comments. It’s just sad to see that unfortunately it’s the viewpoints of such individuals that bring a lot of unhappiness into the world today but starting this argument will open another can of warms and since this forum is not the place to do it, I’m going to leave it at that.
I wasn’t aware that Curves operations were limited to 1st world countries and/or English-speaking ones??? Please can you (the guest) enlighten me as to if there was any language tests to be passed to qualify being a Curves franchisee? All along, I was under the impression that this forum was open to anyone who owns/owned a Curves club regardless of their language skills?
”And, by the way, I only speak English… which is why I’m not posting on Eastern European blogs.” – so you’re suggesting that if one doesn’t speak English, maybe they should not be posting here either? I thought the focus of this blog/forum was Curves franchisees, not demonstrations of personal language skills. Forgive me if I’m mistaken but it’s obvious that one of us is in the wrong blog.
It’s clear that Andres is not very fluent in his English and yes to be honest I don’t literally understand some of his comments either but I seem to have something that you (guest again) lack; common sense. So I’m simply putting 2 and 2 together and coming to an understanding. Let me show you how I do it:
- so far it’s been clear to me that Andres is an unhappy francisee and is having troubles with regards to closing his club
-he is trying to express his anger and frustration, though I admit not always in perfect English and sometimes using words from his own langauge
- so my conclusion is; he is clearly upset. He also sounds very desperate to put an end to his current troubles that he doesn’t even care about getting someone to translate his feelings to perfect English but is obviously writing all his comments in a very emotional state (which explains odd referrals to words in his language…he most likely doesn’t know how to say those words in English but instead tells them in his native language out of sheer frustration)
Mocking or bullying doesn’t get you anywhere and sometimes a simple apology in case of offending anyone makes you a bigger man/woman
I apologize if anybody thought I was calling their country a 3rd world country (unless theirs is). It was an off-the-cuff remark. Since Andre is obviously too timid to disclose his country (despite his bold calls to rise up in arms!) there was no specific country named. But if it sounded derogatory or was offensive I apologize.
And I apologize for leaving the “i” out of Elif. It was an egregious typo.
Other than that, how was I mocking? When did I discourage him from posting? All I did was point out to him that he needed help with translation because no one has any idea what he’s saying. He may have some very valid points that aren’t being communicated because you’re all too polite to tell him. Why let him go on wasting his time posting gibberish when he could tell his story effectively if he had some help?
After all his posts, does anyone know where he’s located? Who he purchased from? Why the sale was supposedly illegal? Why the contract is supposedly invalid? Who he wants to sue? Who is supposedly making death threats? Why he’s intimidating lawyers? Why people want more travel-muck in Poland?
I may be curt but I’m trying to help him get his story out – not suppress it.
On the plus side, Andre, your posts have more clarity and authenticity than unhappy’s. Would it be bigoted and bullying of me to point out that unhappy is still dodging requests for:
1) Even one state that has passed a statute superseding the Curves franchise agreement as a direct result of those who have bonded through this site… as he claimed
2) A list of lawyers who are taking Curves owners cases on straight contingency (he claims there are “plenty”).
Don’t be afraid of truth, people. It supposedly will set you free.
I agree that it would make it easier for us to comment if Andres communicated his problems and story more effectively. Copying and pasting bits of his posts that are difficult to understand and using a sarcastic/ mocking tone-of-voice commenting on them will only make him feel bad . If you’re sincerely interested in what he’s actually trying to say you can always send him a personal email and ask him though; but if you’re not then let him write whatever he wants and post in chinese if he wishes too.
I very much doubt that anyone here treats it as a legal-advice-forum. I personally wanted to see if there was anyone else in the world who went/goes through similar experiences as myself. Obviously, it won’t be solving any of my financial problems but seeing that I am not the only one somehow makes me feel like less of a fool. After all, misery loves company and sometimes hearing similar stories from different people makes it easier to deal with the problems that we’re facing.
On a seperate note, it was good to see your apology from whomever was offended and I’m sure your apology will be accepted
Elif:
Seems that there are a few different types of people here. Some, like you, are here to commiserate, to feel better just to know you’re not alone and offer encouragement.
There are people like unhappy who is filled with rage and really just wants to get back at Howie and would like to see the whole thing burn.
There are others, like me and jd, who have followed this situation and are more interested in getting to the truth about what’s happening, why, and who’s to blame.
But aren’t the most important people here are those the point of deciding whether to close their clubs and, if so, how to proceed?
A feel-good pity party doesn’t help them, and neither does English practice with Andre. unhappy spouting fiction as fact so he can send them into a losing lawsuit or wasting time looking for a contingency lawyer certainly doesn’t help them.
I guess telling it like it is is not the popular thing to do. Sorry about that, too. Maybe the truth about the situation is more useful than patting each other on the head and saying it’s going to be all right.
guest,
do you mind me asking how you came across this forum? are you or have you too been a franchisee? I’m only asking because I wouldn’t be posting here if I didn’t have any business connection, past or present, with Curves. You sound like a smart enough person who would have better things to do than sending posts at a forum that are irrelevant to your business. Unless you too are somehow related to Curves that is…I am genuinely curious, that’s all.
I do not know anybody on this forum on a personal level that includes unhappy too. However from the way I see it his comments are intented to:
1- either give troubled franchisees emotional strength (it’s irrelevant whether you, I or an X person here agrees with his figure of speech)
2- warn potential future franchisees about the potential downsides of the business they consider entering ( again irrelevant whether you, I or an X person here agrees with his figure of speech unless any of us are trying to sell our club or are working in Curves sales department)
3- express his dislike of the business and its CEO ( again the same things above unless any of us here is the CEO himself or are related to him)
You may have some valid points i.e. unhappy not being a qualified legal advisor etc but I didn’t come accross any post where he claims that he is. Again, I don’t know him/her personally but his stance here seems non offensive to anyone. Again, you may have good and valid points that could benefit some people but your tone-of-voice shadows those points and make you look rather like an uncaring person. I don’t suppose anyone would expect a nicely painted picture of Curves here given the name of the website and it makes more sense to visit a ‘happyfranchisee’ website should anyone wish find such a picture.
You may not wish to answer my questions above, like I said I am just curious to know your Curves experience/relation.
Elif:
Suffice it to say that 1) I have experience in franchising & fitness industries both from a franchisee & franchisor perspective, 2) I am not connected with CI in any way. Anything other than that’s just a distraction from the points I make.
My tone is curt and sometimes abrasive, but here’s the deal that franchisees need to come to grips with: They made the decision to become business owners. They signed a big fat legal agreement that completely rules the relationship. If you read all the feel-good marketing hype about “we’re all in this together” but didn’t read the actual agreement you were entering into, you’ve just learned an expensive lesson. I’m not saying it’s right – it’s just the way it is.
unhappy takes this personal and to him it’s all about “howie” and how unethical he is. But that’s irrelevant. The situation is ruled by that big legal doc with your signatures on them and a legal system that basically says you’re on your own – you’re big boys and girls and need to honor your agreements.
I’m sorry to be the one to say this, but business is business.
Where does it say in your legal agreements that the franchisor has to give a damn about you or your family? Where does it say that they don’t have the right to be successful and fly in personal jets and helicopters even if and when you can’t make rent or feed your families? It doesn’t. It does say that the total expectations from either party are contained in that agreement. Expectations outside the agreement, matters of right and wrong, ethical and unethical is really irrelevant.
It’s a game. You all entered it without really understanding the rules, but you’re in it now. Get yourself the meanest nastiest attorney, protect your assets as best you can, get over “right & wrong” and get out as quick and cleanly as you can.
guest,
thank you for your concern
You’re welcome.
I closed 2 Curves franchises in NC in late 2009. We had both clubs about 5 years. The last 2 years we were pouring money in to try to keep them afloat.
It was a painful decision, as we loved our members and staff. We bent over
backwards to make the transition smooth for our members and receiving clubs.
One club (5 miles away from us) received 75 members, and I honestly feel like
if it weren’t for that, the owner would be in the same boat we found ourselves in.
We are in debt up to our eyeballs because of our franchises. We tried our
best to build our business. Curves answer to everything? “Keep putting out
lead bags and getting those buddy referrals.” Gary even had the nerve to say
at the last regional convention I attended (spring of 2009) that unemployment
was “not really that bad” and basically if you were failing it was your fault. I am
so relieved to be out of this, even with the massive amount of debt I still owe.
I did not pay the “settlement fee” thank goodness. If I had that kind of money
I would not have closed. I tried to do everything in my closing as professionally as I could. I am still in contact with former members, former staff, and current owners. Last week I received a letter from a firm in Illinois wanting to negotiate
a settlement for my remaining franchise fees. Thank goodness I was directed
to this site and received some wonderful information and advice. Curves is trying to bully former owners and get anything they can get from you. DON’T DO
IT!!
Thanks for your post and you are certainly right that curvestries to indimidate owners but fortunatly by the knowlege gain from coming here owners are informed on what to do.
By curves owners working together to send a strong message to Howie we are helping to make sure that one million women continue to get stronger
1. Here is the text of an email I received:
I haven’t heard from you regarding the above closed club. Curves International, Inc. (“Curves”) has attempted to work with you through a proper closing. Unfortunately, you have failed to comply with our Closing Program. The closure of the club will now be handled by our Legal Department. Curves will pursue available legal remedies against you for the breach of your franchise agreement.
2. Is this some idle threat? The agreement does not describe any damages or any closing procedures.
3. Suggestions?
To Francine Smith,
It is their way of trying to intimidate you into paying them more of your money and to try to prevent you from joing a lawsuit against them. there are some that you need to be aware of that other owners are doing and if you send an email to; admin at unhappyfranchisee@gmail.com with your phone number I will call you and go over your options.
I just received a list of what I need to do after I close in 15 days. I was like everyone else and sent in the intent to close packet. For anyone that is going down this path, DON’T DO IT!!
I have been in contact with someone who has given me excellent advice, not to be threatened by CI.
I bought my Curvessmart machines and now CI is sending me boxes to my club so that I can send them the smart back.
O.K. has anyone had to do this? Then why am I still paying on this. I didn’t lease, I bought from another closed club.
Lori,
thoses machines are yours so why send them back?. Send the boxes filled with trash back to curves and have them pay the shipping. do not be intimidated by these crooks.
Francine Smith,
I received the same email you did. It’s funny to see that they have a template email that they obviously copy and paste regardless of what the individual cases are. Just goes to show how little they care about us, they can’t even be bothered to send emails appropriate to each case
Howie must think the owners are complete idiots. Well the joke is on him and it doesn’t appear that he is laughing anymore. Thanks to boards like this one!!!!!
■Unhappy on May 15th, 2010 1:35 am
TO All Present and Past Owners of a Curves Franchise
We have all seen the devastation that comes from owning a franchise that is run by a corrupt, unethical, immoral, and crooked owner such as we all believe Howie to be. We have banded together on this site to get the word out about this company so others won’t make the same mistake we all have by falling for the lies, and dishonest treatment by the sociopath, Howie. The number of clubs closing is not only disheartening but frightening when you stop to consider how many people have lost everything including their homes and retirement funds and they continue to close at an alarming rate. it is now time to start a campaign to lobby our government officials to change and strengthen the laws on franchising for the franchisee. I am suggesting that everyone write not only the President but their senator and congressmen as well. If you click on the sites listed below it will take you to where you can send an email to our elected officials and we need to tell them about our experiences we have had with Curves and demand that the franchise laws be changed.
Email via: http://www.whitehouse.gov/contact
[Note: emails are limited to 500 characters, but that is more than enough to make the key points.]
[Note: the WH email page requires a U.S. State and Zip Code to submit.
Here is the sites where you can go to find your Senator and House Representativ
http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm
https://writerep.house.gov/writerep/welcome.shtml
FitDude posted this on Curves Robert Lay’s story early today.
There goes another one……
http://thetimes-tribune.com/news/business/economy-new-competitor-taking-toll-on-area-fitness-businesses-1.793133
I just went to the link and read the article. What a shame and what a bunch of crap from Curves Internationals employee who is quoted in the article. At the end of the article the author or writer leaves their email address to comment about the article. Curves owners not only need to read the article but need to send an email to the writer asking them to do a news story on Curves telling the real truth of what is happening and why all the clubs are closing. Curves Owners it is time we get the real truth out and here is a chance to do just that by sending an email to the author of the news story. Please do so at once!!!!!!!
Unhappy
In the above mentioned article the author quotes Kathy Carr, spokeswoman for Curves International as stating “Ms. Carr said it is difficult to say how Curves is doing overall in the economy since the franchises are independently owned and operated.”
Ms. Carr, have you no integrity, honesty or ethical backbone at all? Where Ms. Carr is your moral compus ? Didn’t your parents raise you better than that? I’m sure they did Ms. Carr, but you have told one heck of a whopper here and you need to explain why you would so blatantly lie like you did. You know Curves clubs are closing at an every increasing rate and the whole Curves empire is about to go belly up as result of Howie’s mismanagement. Come on now Ms. Carr, quit lying and tell the truth. You owe us an explanation for your actions, Ms. Carr.
Well curves is back to trying to be sneakie about the 10,000 dollar closeing fee. Now CII sends out the closing packet and tells owners there is a moderate fee for closing which they will go over with you once you are done following step by step the closing instructions. Howie is now sending out the boxes for owners to return the curves smart equipment and paying for postage. Of course than Howie tries to resale the smart for 6,000 dollares. Owners it is your equipment don’t send it back you can sell it after you close.
Hello We closed the club, but so far we did not have asked. It took only 30 days from the date of closing. We closed without closing procedures, but before that we had several times told the curves that we can no longer pay the costs and will have to close the club.
Andres,
Sorry to hear about you having to close but every day we hear more horror stories about clubs closing so you are not alone. Keep us informed on what unethical, immoral, and unchristian like conduct Howie tries to use to extort more money from you. Don’t pay them another dime, Andres as Howie is just a crook.
I sent CI a message telling them I was financially unable to keep my curves open
They told me closing was not an option and sent me an expense sheet to fill out
Has anyone experienced this before
yes Lan this is standard proceedures for CII. They should have told you you have two days to respond. Do not respond until you talk to me. Send an email to admin at at unhappyfranchisee@gmail.com with your phone number I will call you and go over your options and what do expect from Curves. Do not sign anything until you talk to me.
I just started the process of closing my club and did the exact same thing Lan has done with the expense sheet to fill out and return in two weeks.
I have done this and have been awaiting to hear a response from CI. Then I had this gut feeling I needed to do some digging online and came across this site.
My husband and I have been in financial ruin over this. It’s been exhausting with many sleepless nights. Once we made the decision to close, I thought it would get better. Now I find myself worried about closing fees, taking down signs and donating equipment.
Would love to have some advice on how to proceed to avoid paying Curves another dime, or following their “you must donate to a women’s prison” rules.
Thanks so much.
Jenny,
Do not respond until you talk to me. Send an email to admin at at unhappyfranchisee@gmail.com with your phone number I will call you and go over your options and what do expect from Curves. Do not sign anything until you talk to me. Unhappy but getting happier every day
thank you so much. I’ve sent the email. Coming across this site feels like such a blessing. I look forward to hearing from you.
Hi Jenny! I hope you are fine and you are reassured. I think that had made the right decision to close the club. We had a tighter very problem and the same sleepless nights that you do. We told Curves that we will close the club but the answer was a stupid meaningless letter in which they said they were studying the situation of our club. Then contact us master franchise in the country with threats and intimidation. But we still decided to close the club. When you are freed from this, you understand that the money you lost is not important, what is important is that you can live a normal life. You begin to notice their children’s wife, the outside world, you can sleep until 10 am and do not think that the monster will no longer touch you and suck out your blood. Write me and we will be able to communicate with you, I’ll tell you more about what was happening to us. I met many people from Europe, the clubs have closed due to bankruptcy and we want to unite. Waiting for your reply.
Thanks Andres. I’ll feel much better once I’ve spoken with someone about how to deal with Curves and the $10,000 fee and how to handle the equipment and other things….
Hello I tried to talk to them about the equipment, but I did not say anything. In my address was followed by the threat. I longer wish hear anything from them. Locked in a world very much in Bulgaria – a club in Turkey – 4 Club, UK – 3 Club, Spain – 3 Club. And that’s not all. It is only those people with whom I spoke. Some continue to work on this equipment and spit on the curves. I read that in their plans to hit Ukraine, Russia and India. Only in Ukraine they want to open 250 clubs, 250 in India, I do not know how many in Russia.
Jenny,
It is going to be ok, I have a peace about closing, I hate it for my members that have stuck it out with me but there was no way we could have forseen the economy. Hang in there, this too shall pass. Remember how scary it was when you opened your Curves. If we can get thru that we can get thru anything.
God Bless
1. I did not respond to this emai:
I haven’t heard from you regarding the above closed club. Curves International, Inc. (“Curves”) has attempted to work with you through a proper closing. Unfortunately, you have failed to comply with our Closing Program. The closure of the club will now be handled by our Legal Department. Curves will pursue available legal remedies against you for the breach of your franchise agreement.
2. Can I expect further communication? A letter?
3. Is there any reason to actually do anything?
Francine,
Please send an email to admin at unhappyfranchisee@gmail.com with your phone number and ask for it to be forwarded to me and I will call you and go over what to expect from Curves. do not sign anything that they send you or respond without talking to me first. Unhappy
Francine,
I highly recommend you contacting Unhappy. He spent the better part of an hour with me this past Sunday and walked me through every single scare tactic Curves has up their sleeve. He was also able to guide me on what I needed to do to protect myself.
I’m already putting a plan of action together to make sure that I’m not one of the thousands of people Curves is bankrupting. Finding this site and talking with Unhappy was truly a blessing. Good luck, I know exactly how you’re feeling.
-Jenny
Hi Jenny! Unhappy is really good man, I spoke with him. You’re not alone, we have a lot. It does not matter from which country we are and what languages we speak. The important thing is that we must stand up and not fall, after what happened to us. Often think – maybe I create one that something bad in your life, that road has brought me to the curves. But this is not true. We just had to go through it that would be better and appreciate the life that we had to the curve. We are all avidly pursued for profit, and we have sold the American dream of own business. But business was not ours, it is entirely their business. Hold on, you all will be well.
Hello
I closed the club a month ago, ie they used I do not use the second month. But Curves, I regularly send messages that are not paid royalties. I leave these letters without attention, as I announced to their legal department to close the club, but the clear answer I received. What people do in this case? Closure of the club was due to inability to pay for expenses.
I am just curious to see if anyone on this website signed a contract that states that Curves is eligible for future royalty fees after the termination of the agreement ??? Don’t the contracts say that the ”the monthly royalty fees will be paid during the term of the agreement OR until the agreement is terminated for any reason”?
Hola Andres! como estas? no te procupes por las cartas : ) todo va a ir bien : )
Elif,
The franchise agreement is vague and can be interpreted either way but the fact is that it is illegal for Curves to try to collect franchise fees and advertising fees once you have closed. This is in the Texas state laws and Curves International knows this but still tries to intimidate and extort those fees from owners.
So I just received my intent to close packet via email today. Am I understanding correctly that I should simply ignore it and the demands of Curves International? I want to make sure I’m doing everything I should be doing to protect myself and my family.
Thanks so much!
I too just received my intent to close packet in the mail. From what I’m reading, it seems like I should ignore this. My wife and I are thinking of just filling it out and trying to negotiate with CI just to put this whole thing behind us. I mean, what’s one more grand in the scheme of things.
Has anyone been able to move beyond the threatened $49,000 for not following closing procedures? Would love to hear from you.
Ryan,
Don’t pay curves one more dime. Send an email to admin at at unhappyfranchisee@gmail.com with your phone number I will call you and go over your options and what do expect from Curves. Do not sign anything until you talk to me.
Howie is at it again trying to rip off owners who have bought into the Curves Smart equipment (about 45% of the clubs bought into it) If it wasn’t bad enough when Howie came up with the Curves Smart idea he sold it to franchises as new technology (it was actually ten years old at the time and never worked than nor does it work now) and that Curves International would spend hundreds upon hundreds of thousands of dollars advertising the roll out of Curves Smart to generate new members coming into clubs. Of course all owners now know that was just another lie from Howie as so far there has been no national advertising campaign for Curves Smart, .
But now Howie and Curves International is KNOWINGLY strong-handedly trying to get owners who have closed to violate their leases with the CS leasing company. In short, when one takes out a lease for capital equipment, it is standard in such leases that the lessee MUST maintain possession of the equipment until the lease is up. At that point, you return the equipment to the leasing company (like a car lease, for example) or you have a buy-out clause (often $1). Most Curves owners have a $1 buy-out clause. Howie and Curves International is telling owners who have Smart and have closed that they “have to” return the CS equipment to curves International, although no where does it say that owners have to do this (especially if owners own the equipment!). The wording of their closing documents (that someone kindly posted on the owners-managers site) specifically notes that if you have a lease, you need to be aware of the chain of possession. Somehow they think this will get them out of trouble with the leasor. Anyway, they are offering to “release” people from their franchise agreement IF they return the CS equipment, but what is someone who has a lease supposed to do? They are then selling the “refurbished” equipment to a new owner for $6,000. MyTrak was NOT happy to hear about this and said that it has nothing to do with Curves International (they recommended to one owner to keep her equipment and try to sell it to another owner). And not surprisingly, United Leasing does not seem particularly happy either. One owner posted that they were VERY upset when she returned the equipment to curves International , since she owes the lease. Just another case of Howie’s fraudulent business tactics Howie you are nothing but a crook.
Many owners are questioning if curves is still trying to collect a 10,000 dollar closing fee. It has now been officially verified that indeed Howie is still trying to collect the closing fee in lieu of receiving a so called mutual release. Bur Howie now calls it “Rite of Passage instead of a closing fee and refuses to tell owners how much it is in closing procedures other than it is a nominal fee which must go in front of the closing board to determine how much the owner must pay. Howie must think the owners are stupid as everyone knows he is the board and it’s still 10,000 but of course In the true crook fashion Howie will negotiate it down to around 3000 dollars. Of course as most owners know the so called mutual release is not mutual and lawyers have advised not to sign such a document as it only protects Howie from being sued and Curves can still try to sue the owners. Of course now days Howie just sends the owners to a illegal ILL collection agency. See ■googled it on June 1st, 2010 2:56 pm at http://www.unhappyfranchisee.com/curves-robert-lays-story/
Hi Everyone,
First, I think it’s awesome that there’s a place for us to come together and vent and just be supportive. If nothing else, this site has been great for my wife and I because for a while there, we really felt alone.
Having said that, I must ask: Has anyone taking Unhappy’s advice and really been able to beat the giant?
The reason I have to ask this question is because $49,000 is ALOT of money. If our contract states that there is a $10,000 closing penalty, for whatever reason, aren’t we obligated to pay that amount? We all read the agreement (or at least I hope most of you did) and were aware that there was such a penalty.
If Curves International is working with clubs to lower this fee, than wouldn’t a court of law see this and award any kind of lawsuit in the favor of CI.
Unhappy, please know I’m not trying to say that you”re wrong here, it’s just a big gamble with my family’s future. Plus, I don’t have the money to fight such a lawsuit. I’ve spent years building my credit and my word is my bond. If I agreed to pay the fee, I feel like I’d be breaking my promise if I didn’t.
Having said that, do I think it’s unethical that CI continues to bleed those who have lost everything, ABSOLUTELY! I don’t know how anyone over in legal can sleep at night knowing this “penalty fee” is literally taking food out of the mouths of children. It’s simply wrong.
I am following the closing guidelines CI has sent into place. My equipment will be donated as of July 1, 2010 to a women’s prison and I will do all they ask. Then I will hopefully talk with someone in legal about having the fees waived all together. Chelley Breemes has been quite nice and I’m hoping will continue to help me during our financial crisis.
If anyone on this site has taken unhappy’s advice and won, I’d love to hear about it.
“My equipment will be donated as of July 1, 2010 to a women’s prison…”
Is anyone else concerned about the massive amounts of Curves fitness equipment being donated to women’s prisons? Could Howie’s closing requirements actually result in our country soon being overrun by an army of super-fit and empowered female ex-convicts in just a few short years?
Could that actually be Howie’s diabolical plan… to lead this Amazon army to world domination?
And why do these prisons need 30 minute workout equipment? I mean, it’s not like prisoners have busy schedules and are pressed for time.
If you want to talk to other owners of curves who have filed a lawsuit against Howie and CI check out this site
http://www.wsicorporate.com/article/curves_franchise_lawsuits
I received a demand letter asking for royalties and advertising fees totaling over $25,000. Advice?
Mike it depends on if it is the termination for abandonment or from the lawyer (collection service from ILL). You can send an email to admin at at unhappyfranchisee@gmail.com and he will forward it to me and if you enclude your email address or phone number I will contact you to go over how to protect yourself against Curves and it’s questionable business tactics.
Just wondering? I was going to close at the end of Aug when a buyer appeared, she knows I don’t make money but is willing to give it a go, she currently works at a curves, so my question, we are in BC and Ci wants $5000 USD for transfer fees, what the hell do they do that could possibly be worth $5000USD? I sent them an e-mail saying that I was selling for $5000 CANADIAN $ so there was NO WAY I can pay what they want, has anyone beat the transfer fee??? I certainly don’t have the money and even after the sale I will not, accountants government tax$, you know how it goes.
My wife owns a Curves that she bought from another person ..Long and short we need to close due to not making money and going broke. I don’t want to boar you with the deatils as our story is just like everyones.
The landloard will let us out of the lease. .
How do we start the process of closing ..Reading all the posts I am not sure what to do should… Should i tell them now , get the closing packet, just close shop or try to sell it for a dollar,
I never seen anything in the franchise agreement that speaks to any kind of $10,000 closing fee… Is there still a transfer fee if you sell, if so is it still 5k.
Please help we need information ASAP. Let me know what to expect and what to do!!!!!
Paul, my franchise agreement does not say anything about a closing fee but as far as the transfer fee goes I sent them an e-mail saying I was selling for $5000 and they were not getting it, I had an almost immediate reply and the fee was dropped to $1000, so I just went with it. You are lucky, my landlord would not let me out of the lease and I was walking out on it.
Folks
Please help how do i start the process for closing down!!!!
How much advance notice should i give Curves? if I am closing?
Hi Paul,
The first thing you’ll need to do is contact Curves. They’ll send you a closing package. This will include your letter for intent to sell. It’s actually quite simple. If you want to close by October 1st, now is the time to contact them. Plus, it will give your current members plenty of notice.
Curves asked us to stop drafts for the entire month, but, we didn’t. We felt it unfair that some of those members were basically getting a free month of membership…so, we stopped at around the 2nd or 3rd week of the month. Although we did tell Curves we stopped. We did however reimburse all of our pre-pay members.
I know there have been horror stories on here about how Curves has gone after people for $40,000 plus, and if you just close your doors, that’s exactly what they’ll do. However, I followed all of their procedures…fudged a little about a few things, but, for the most part, met their requirements.
They accepted everything and asked that we pay $1750 as a settlement. I explained that our credit cards were maxed and were completely swimming in debt and they released us without penalty.
I was nice, responsive and agreeable throughout the whole closing process, so, I imagine that made a difference as well.
My suggestion is for you to contact your area rep first. She’ll most likely refer you to the legal department and they’ll begin the closing procedures on their end. Make sure you are upfront that you’ve heard rumors of a $10,000 closing fee and that if you had $10,000 to pay it, you wouldn’t be closing the club to begin with. But, be nice about it.
While I do believe that Curves International has done some shady things and has been motivated by greed for a while now, there is still a chance for you to cut your losses and move on without further debt.
Good luck friends…
I understand about reimbursing members for prepays. We are not bonded in our state to take prepays; so, that worry is gone. However, if a member pays a sign up fee when joining and has not finished their 12 month agreement, are we obligated to refund sign up fees? I’m thinking “yes” maybe? With the forcast of probably having to close, I’m thinking it might be in our interest to not charge a sign up fee for the very, very few people joining right now.
I’m not sure what state your in or it’s law regarding this, but, we didn’t have to reimburse anyone for the service fee. The service fee isn’t for the year. We had people join the month before we closed. We literally made the decision to close though one day and turned around and did it the next. So, if you know you’ll be closing, yes, be honest and waive the service fee, but, you shouldn’t give any monies back to current members who signed with you before the decision was made…
Read this post at everyjoe.com. Curves International should be held accountable.
By Di
36 days ago BE SCARED. DON’T BUY!
http://everyjoe.com/work/is-curves-for-women-a-good-franchise-investment/
Read this post at everyjoe.com.
By Di
36 days ago BE SCARED. DON’T BUY!
http://everyjoe.com/work/is-curves-for-women-a-good-franchise-investment/
I’m merging my clubs. CI said they were doing me a favor by allowing me out of my contract. They’re charging me $2000 to combine. I like many of you don’t want and cannot pay $2000. However if I close my bank acct they will not be able to draw fees for the club I’m keeping open. Therefore I’m sure they’ll also cut my wellness reimbursements.
Any suggestions?
Thankyou. I’m dying here.
Kathy, The $2,000.00 to combine, does that create a new 5 year agreemant with your strong club? Be careful.
Kathy, yes be VERY careful. They may try to lock you into a 5 year agreement. I have a friend who negotiated a 2 year contract (instead of 5) for renewing an agreement. I also have friends who closed clubs-having others open-and never paid anything. I think they are only going after owners if they close all of their clubs-they don’t want to jeopardize getting money from their remaining clubs.
They got letters from CI, and told them they didn’t have the money for the closing fee, and they haven’t heard anything else. I closed 2 clubs in 2009-both of my clubs. I did everything the way I was supposed to except for getting rid of my
equipment. I refuse to send it back, and there isn’t a market for selling it right
now to other owners. I’m holding on to it until I can figure out something. I
got the letter from CI legal in January, and in April, got the letter from the collection agency in Illinois. I have ignored both. I have back rent and loans
from the initial investment and others taken out to try to keep the clubs going.
I am filing bankruptcy which will take care of the backrent, one business loan
(the others were home equity which I will still be responsible for) and the
Curves claim. I really don’t think Curves can get the future royalties, but the
crooked collection agency has reported it to the credit bureau-which I recently
found out. They put the whole amount on my husbands credit report too, and
he is only on one of the agreements. I am going to dispute this, but my
credit is in the toilet anyway because of the bankruptcy. I cannot wait to put
this all behind me. You are dealing with some slimeballs here, so be very
careful!! Good luck to you! You may want to tell Curves that if they won’t waive
the fee you will have to close the weaker club.
Hi Ketley!
What do you say, I closed the club earlier this year, so how are things started going badly and the club has begun to yield losses in the amount of 1500 euros per month. When I realized that the situation is not fixable and will not improve, I decided to close, and now I am grateful to the day when I made a decision. Now my wife and I remember laughing about that story that happened to us, it was the misunderstandings in our lives. We were threatened that we will have to pay royalties until the end of the contract and the like, but we could no longer live in this nightmare. I closed my account and credit card companies, but to date no curves do not bother us and I think that will never be disturbed. So to solve and be free from what’s stopping you to live normally.
I am NOT a Curves owner but a member and have been very frustrated by the limited hours the gym is open as well as the pressure to only conform to 3 workouts a week. I’d like to have the option to work out 5 days a week without feeling like there’s a problem with it.
I’ve only been to one Curves that seemed to want to accomodate its members that didn’t close for 3 or 4 hours every afternoon. Fortunately, it’s still in operation but I moved from the area. I really think closing in the afternoons and not having enough equipment isn’t helping.
However, I’m very sorry for the problems that owners are having with the corporate offices. Best wishes to everyone.
Curves is too busy dealing with closing clubs to take any legal action. Call their bluff.
[...] CURVES: Negotiating the $10,000 Closing Fee October 12, 2009 (149 Comments) [...]
For those of you who are closing or have already closed, are you being asked to pay the minimum or maximum royalties and ad fees for the remainder of the franchise agreement? Also, while I signed personally on the franchise agreement, I was offered the opportunity to convey/transfer it into my corporate name, which I did. Do you know if this protects my personal assets and credit from being impacted? I suppose these are questions for an attorney, which I may consult, but since I’m in the red, monthly, I’m trying to minimize any further expenses. Thanks.
Hi Donna! I closed my club more than a year ago, but nothing else I did not get the curves. The only thing that I have received a verbal threat from a master franchise, but no more. If you are from America, you may you have more problems with it. But I live in another country and the curves I have had in the third. When I closed, I knew what happiness and life. I sincerely wish you good luck. Without worrying about all the good will link. Spoke with Lloyd he closed it in your country.
Thank you, Andres. I wish you good luck as well.
Hi Donna! How are things? How was your closing and how things are with curves? I hope you are fine and you never hear about the curves. Sincerely, Andres
Hi Andres, I have not closed. I’m still crunching numbers to decide what I’m going to do. I hope you’re enjoying being “Curves-free”. Thank for asking.
Hi Donna! In any case, I wish you luck and strength in all that you planned. I know what experience the process of closing, customers, curves, rent and so on. You must make that decision, which will be most advantageous and convenient for you and your family. Good luck.
My Dear folks,
My club is doing well due to our effort in advertising door to door, and the high turnover in the apartments here.
My question is that we offer a lot more than curves workout, and most of our members skip it entirely, so I would like to know, how can I become free of curves and just run my gym. Has anyone ever done this? What about the contracts with the members and the curvessmart equipment. BTW my contract with CI runs out in 2 months.
Curves has become a liability for me.
Thanks,
Dr Dan