IS AMWAY A SCAM?

1,020 thoughts on “IS AMWAY A SCAM?”

• ibofightback, I can see you point about not working and sitting back and enjoying life. I am not they type that just likes to sit there and do nothing. I did invest a good amount of money in to my business and at times struggled but, i got through it. and for the average 23 year old i feel i have come farther than most young male adults my age. i will say amway is a business but built on someone else’s dream not yours. and this is all just my opinion i am not going to sit and throw numbers and figures at everyone saying this is the way to go. I enjoy meeting the people that i do business with and help them in what they need. and watch as my assets and business prosper. both of my business are now self sustaining, and i can do the job that i love to do, which is a UAV operator, if you dont know what it is then look it up on google or something this is to the furthest extent i will go in explaining what i do for a living. i can see why people would want to get into amway and that because it marketed as easy to get into and easy to get money and in some cases it probably is. on that note what would life be with out a challenge, it would probably suck quite bad and be very dull and grey. so that’s what i seek is the challenge.

  *US army- 15W
  *ASE certified automotive tec
  *associates in business administration- working on my BA in aerospace engineering

  An armed man is a citizen. An unarmed man is a subject~Unknown

• Sleven7,

  Actually my point wasn’t about not working and sitting back and enjoying life. I’ll be working until the day I die, and loving every minute of it! The point was to (hopefully) educate you about the nature of an Amway business cf with most other businesses.

  Why do you think Amway is a business built on “someone else’s dream” and is somehow different to other businesses? You mentioned you had an automotive business. If this is selling cars, then your selling cars made by somebody else.Even if you custom make them, I’m pretty certain the materials come from someone else.

  Unless your extracting the ore and smelting it yourself, and following the process all the way through, for every thing you use and sell in your businesses, then your businesses are also built on “someone else’s dream”. That doesn’t mean your business isn’t built on your dreams. That’s capitalism and free enterprise.

  I don’t know how Amway was marketed to you, but it wasn’t quite marketed the same way to me. Yes, easy to get in to – but no, not “easy money”. Like any business it takes years of hard work to develop a stable, profitable business.

• Joecool, really? Why would they promote Double X as well as Daily? Maybe because there’s more profit in it? I promoted lots of products, including ones with less profit than daily!

  Why would I subtract active IBO purchases (I assume you mean for personal use)? Heck, in some of Amway’s biggest markets (like Russia), government regulations mean only IBOs are allowed to buy Nutrilite.

  But you just want to arbitrarily exclude them?

  Gee,Joecool, why don’t we just assume Amway gives away all their Nutrilite products for free, then we can claim their last in sales!

  Since you’re happy just to make @£$! up to try to “prove” your point, why not go the whole hog?

  Anyway, even if we could subtract IBO personal use like my own, Nutrilite would almost certainly still be #1. Nutrilite is Amway’s #1 seller to customers, and active IBOs all have numerous customers buying it. Not to mention China is the biggest market, and the products, though marketed by IBOs, are sold through stores there.

  Continuing on the lines of making things up, your made up $100/mth figure is pretty damn good income for those 54% of IBOs that do so little they’re not even classified “active” by Amway! $100 for doing nothing! A month!

  Anything else you want to pluck out of your a** Joecool?

• I guess you don’t have much of a imagination ibofightback, I own a repair shop, and own the name to it, do you own the name to amway? can you clam it belongs to you? I can say that I own mine. I spent days going to city hall to register the name of my company getting the permits to operate and slowly building MY business. I’m sure you didn’t do that with amway. The reason i have a negetive look towards your business is because it sells a false hope to people that are desperate to find a way out of the hole they are in. my good friend just graduated college and he is being sold false hope as we speak. He is going to take his 4 years of hard work and throw it away doing something he has probably no passion for or probably doesn’t care about. I may also be young but youth has nothing to do with business. and i don’t think you would want to see the end result of what i can do in 10 years. failure is not a word that i use, failure is just a excuse for people who didn’t try hard enough. tell me good sir what were you doing at 23?( i like a good argument so this i why I’m on this forum)

• SLeven7 makes some great points.

  “The reason i have a negative look towards your business is because it sells a false hope to people that are desperate to find a way out of the hole they are in.”

  That’s true. Amway’s appeal is that they sell instant access. No college or trade school degree required. No experience necessary. No craft to learn and refine. All you need is your will to succeed (meaning, either greed or desperation), a lemming-like willingness to follow and a parrot-like ability to repeat Ambot catch-phrases and non-sequiters.

  “my good friend just graduated college and he is being sold false hope as we speak. He is going to take his 4 years of hard work and throw it away doing something he has probably no passion for or probably doesn’t care about.”

  Aren’t people more likely to be successful when they are passionate about the business they are in? Did the Ambots give a crap about detergent, shoe polish, or supplements before they started faking their interest in crap Walmart sells by the acre? Is ibofb really be passionate about the impact Centrum and Nutrilite is having on consumer’s budgets, or does his Amway brainwashing enable him to slip into ridiculously banal speeches with no self-awareness of how disingenuous he sounds?

  Amway is a classic solution in search of a problem. Walmart, Kmart, Walgreens, CVS, thousands of shopping centers and websites are doing just fine providing the products we need at affordable prices. If you want to make money, go work for them for minimum wage instead of getting an AmBotomy. It might not make for great self-delusion, but at the end of two years you’ll actually have money in the bank, which is mmore than AmBots can say.

• Sleven, you seem to be suggesting your business is better because there’s more bureaucracy to deal with that doesn’t actually help grow your business?

  That’s an advantage of an Amway business, not a disadvantage. As it happens, yes I did need to get a business licence and register my trading name for my Amway business (and it’s no “Amway”). Someplace jurisdictions you don’t need to do this, some you do. Most larger Amway businesses are LLC’s or Corporations.

  Do you own the building and land where you have your repair shop? Did you build the building? Did you make the bricks? Did you dig the ore and smelt the metal to make your tools? etc etc. Your business is built on the dreams of others who did those things. That’s free enterprise.

  As for your friend, why on earth is he throwing away his 4 years of study? What’s he going to do with his time? Amway is designed to be done *part-time*. Indeed many argue (myself included) that it’s *harder* to start an Amway business as your only full-time venture. If he’s being encouraged by his (potential?) upline not to pursue what ever dreams he had around his studies, and not continue to work in that field if he wants to, then his potential upline are idiots and we’re in agreement – tell him to run!

  At 23 I was working full-time in University research helping develop some products that have made a real difference in the world and saved many lives. I was also coaching at a sports club that I had founded and (2 years later) won the championship, I was on the executive committee on another club. I had been running a franchise as well, something I got out of.

  There’s plenty of 23yr olds out their doing great things with their lives, Sleven7.

  “Guest” – anyone promoting Amway as “instant success” is (a) lying (b) breaking Amway’s rules – you should report them to Amway. Either that or it’s you being disingenuous.

  And yes, I’m incredibly passionate about Nutrilite and the Nutrilite approach.

  It seems your experience with Amway has been with IBOs like Joecool, who couldn’t be bothered to learn anything about the products and what differentiates them in the marketplace, and who gave up after 9 months because it was all too hard and not “instant success” or “easy money” like he’d clearly hoped.

  Amway, and professional Amway IBOs are very clear – it takes hard work for years to build a stable, profitable Amway business.

  Strangely, I’ve never heard an Amway IBO say differently, but I’ve heard a number of critics claim they do. It takes me again to the U. Westminster study on attitudes to direct selling, which found that the people with negative attitudes about the industry were the ones with very little exposure to it. They’d just been influenced by gossip and hearsay, and these days, the internet echo chamber

• Anyway, I’m bowing out of this discussion now, I don’t think there’s much more to be said. I’m going to go outside and plan where I’m going to build a couple of ponds ….

  May you have great success in whatever ventures you to choose to pursue in your lives.

• ibofightback is a master of picking out a lesser point of an opponent’s argument, or distorting or exaggerating a main point, and then attacking it.

  SLeven7 was making the point that it’s more worthwhile to build your own brand and be more in control of your own business than starting one where you’re dependent on a single supplier and operating under their name. ibofb attacks him for saying that more bureaucracy is better, which he didn’t say.

  I make the point that Amway sucks people in because it offers a chance to get started instantly without having to take the time to learn an actual skill or develop a useful craft. ibofb changes my argument to meaning that Amway promises instant success, which I never said.

  ibofb has developed this handy, diversional trick in order to promote a dubious system providing an unnecessary solution. Kind of like Amway as a whole.

  I pity the poor Koi destined to inhabit those ponds. Not only will they have to endure having names like “Birdie” “Dexter” “Ponzi” and “Rich DeVos,” they won’t be able to get away when he starts quoting them 30 year old Amway statistics and quoting Mike Wallace in the 80s.

• oh good grief, I can’t let that pile of stinking BS remain unanswered.

  (1) I am an atheist and progressive liberal. You really think I’d name my pets after right-wing evangelicals like the Yagers? I don’t like the Yagers. I don’t like their approach, I don’t like the damage that approach has done to Amway’s (and by extension, my) business

  (2) Sleven7 mentioned the issues of paperwork for getting a business started, I thought he did so under the misbelief that an Amway IBOship isn’t a “real” business and that this was evidence of it.

  (3) Yes, one of the weaknesses of the MLM model is you don’t have the freedom to develop your own brand. Franchising has the same “weakness”. It’s my opinion that weakness is made up for through various strengths of the model.

  (4) My apologies I misread “instant access” as “instant success”. Yes, the fact you can get started without many of the headaches of a traditonal business is indeed an advantage of the model. (note: it’s not unique in this though)

  (5) I haven’t quoted any 30 year old statistics. Surprisingly (not) you didn’t seem to have a problem with Joecool quoting 43 year old statistics. That was just fine and dandy huh?

  (6) Mike Wallace spent a year investigating Amway, he came up with a positive view of the company. Professor Dominique Xardel spent several years researching Amway and came to a positive view. The University of Westminster study found that, overall, people with experience with direct sales companies (Amway was one they included) had positive views of the industry. Reader’s Digest finds, year after year, that people throughout Asia have positive views of the products. Amway Korea was named one of that countries most well respected foreign companies. Consumer Labs, year after year, reports US consumers of Nutrilite are the most satisfied. The “Favorite of Experts” and “Favorite of Consumers” panels in the Ukraine have given multiple awards to Amway products. eSpring has won multiple awards around the world, and it’s technology is now being licenced and developed by many of the world’s largest manufacturers.

  I can go on and on with independently assessed facts

  And you can go on and on and hang on desperately to your opinions that the products are generic and the sales system “unnecessary” and use your diversionary rants (the Yagers? Really?) to distract from reality as much as you like.

  It won’t change reality.

• “Mike Wallace spent a year investigating Amway, he came up with a positive view of the company.”

  Mike Wallace also endorsed Phillip Morris cigarettes for being so smooth and natural, then died of heart disease. Mike Wallace also reported that homosexuals are incapable of a lasting relationship and that one-night stands and casual sex was the norm in homosexual relationships.

  Great endorser… NEXT!

  “Professor Dominique Xardel spent several years researching Amway and came to a positive view.”

  The great Professor Xardel?! Didn’t Peter Sellers play him in a madcap comedy? NEXT!

  “The University of Westminster study found that, overall, people with experience with direct sales companies (Amway was one they included) had positive views of the industry.”

  I believe they called that the “Shekhar Study,” did they not? In another Westminister study, 100% people of people who attend UFO conventions believe that UFOs probably exist. NEXT!

  “Reader’s Digest finds, year after year, that people throughout Asia have positive views of the products.”

  Seriously? A Reader’s Digest poll of people in Asia? Ha! NEXT!

  “Amway Korea was named one of that countries most well respected foreign companies…”

  …Right behind Puppy Mart, the tender choice…

  “Consumer Labs, year after year, reports US consumers of Nutrilite are the most satisfied.”

  Ah, yes, Consumer Labs… the company named to intentionally be confused with Consumer Reports. The company that takes money both from consumers for supposedly objective research and more money from the companies it is supposedly investigating. According to the Health Wyze report “Consumer Labs apparently has the best objective science that money can buy.”

  http://healthwyze.org/index.php/component/content/article/348-evaluating-the-evaluators-from-consumer-labs.html

  ibofb, if you wonder why no one believes the “factual” arguments you and your smarmy Amway peddlers push, it’s because you throw try to pass off bogus crap like “Consumer Labs,” and your deceptions are continually exposed. NEXT!

  “The “Favorite of Experts” and “Favorite of Consumers” panels in the Ukraine have given multiple awards to Amway products.”

  Really?! Panels in the Ukraine like Amway?! Sign me up! Those Ukrainian mail-order brides will make a huge target market in the US and UK, especially for anti-aging cream and heavy make-up!

  “eSpring has won multiple awards around the world, and it’s technology is now being licenced and developed by many of the world’s largest manufacturers.”

  That seals the deal! Amway rules! Because when it comes to selling stupid worthless overpriced products like eScam Water Filtration system to clueless, trusting people, Amway is the best!

• wow … racist much?

  Mike Wallace, after learning more, also later become a vehement spokesperson againt smoking and against tobacco companies.

  Professor Xardel is a former head of one of the world’s top business schools,ESSEC, and an editor for Harvard Business Review.

  The study published by U. of Westminister is titled “Public Perceptions of Direct Selling: An International Perspective”. The authors were from University of Westminster, University of New Mexico, National Sun Yat-sen University, De La Salle University, Monash University, University of Natal, Helsinki School of Economics, and San Diego State University.

  None of them are called “Shekar”

  Consumer Labs is a respected independent company. Your choice of “source” in enlightening. A web page with the motto “Powered by God’s Medicine” that promotes woo like “the health wyze collodial copper lotion, featuring electrically extracted atom sized copper for extreme joint and skin rejuvenation”.

  Uhuh. Still, they get something right. In the comments of the article you linked to, the managing editor recommends “food-based” vitamin supplements. You know, like Nutrilite has been doing for more than 75 years.

  But hey, why should anyone bother with independent, professional, and academic studies in to Amway? You got anonymous posters like “guest” on the intertubes to tell you the real story, away from all illuminati running the great global conspiracy.

  Need a tin foil hat, guest? Or you too busy playing with your guns in case the yellow hoards invade ….

• IBOFightback is the master of spin. Amway has a crappy reputation in the US for good reasons. Those reasons include people getting tricked and scammed by IBOs who run unethical businesses. Yes, that;s not Amway the company, but it’s not like Amway has run these folks out of town. IBOFB likes to cite “TEAM” as evidence that Amway takes action, but the TEAM issue was different because TEAM challenged Amway. I believe that it why they were shown the door. Had they kept quiet, they would still be running today.

  Also, most IBOs make nothing or love money, even if they bust their butts working hard. Obviously, working hard is not promoted. instead, it is walking the beaches while checks keep rolling in. IBOFB denies this, but groups such as WWDB have functions called “Dream Night: where they promote this.

  Apparently, IBOs are still taught “buy from yourself”, If Amway did not count sales to IBOs, they might not have much left to report.

  Despite some “crowns” and others who are Amway “millionaires”. the average IBO income is around $100 a month. It’s $200 a month if you don’t count the ones who “do nothing”. That means the median income is probably $20 a month with the crowns and diamonds pulling up the averages.

  Stick a feather in your tinfoil hat IBOFB.

• And joecool is back to pull out more fake figures and fake claims out of his a**. See if you can find your head up there Steve!

  And with that, I am done. Ciao.

• Joecool writes “IBOFightback is the master of spin.”

  Yes, but you gotta love these Amway guys. Almost everything they cut and paste to impress is questionable. If they brag that Professor Jaques Clouseau is the editor of the Harvard Business Review and he loves Amway, you can bet that he is FORMER editor of the FRENCH edition (as opposed to the real HBR) Harvard Business Review and he probably said something much less direct in some obscure study, perhaps derived from polls of nearsighted Reader’s Digest readers in Rangoon.

  Joecool writes “Amway has a crappy reputation in the US…”

  Yes, but I understand that Amway is extremely well-thought of by chain-smoking test subjects in Ukraine!

  Joecool writes “the average IBO… median income is probably $20 a month”

  Maybe that explains why neither Mike Wallace (before the cigs he endorsed killed him), Professor Charles Francis Xavier, nor the authors of the study published by U. of Westminister from University of Westminster, University of New Mexico, National Sun Yat-sen University, De La Salle University, Monash University, University of Natal, Helsinki School of Economics, and San Diego State University EVER decided to sell Amway products themselves despite their proof that it’s the greatest opportunity since Carlo Pietro Giovanni Guglielmo Tebaldo Ponzi.

• I think IBOFightback is becoming desperate in his never ending defense of Amway. If you scrool up a bit, you can see where I pointed out that a guy from Amway/WWDB made a bogus claim about Amway/WWDB IBOs having a 2% divorce rate while the rest of the world is at 60%. IBOFightback actually tries to pass it off as true or at least possible. The fact of the matter is that it is made up and cannot be verified unless Amway and/or WWDB keeps records of marriages and divorces among their IBOs.

  I make the claim that most IBOs make nothing or lose money and IBOFB tries to defend this by saying most IBOs don’t do anything. Fine, you have just confirmed that most IBOs make nothing or lose money, Even those who work very hard have a very low success rate. All of this is made even worse bacause Amway has a bad reputation in the US.

  IBOs involved in the tools system usually gets hosed financially. IBOFB tries to minimize this by saying most IBOs do nothing and that few IBOs are using the tools system. But if you calculate this the same way Amway figures their average income, by disregarding the ones who “do nothing”, then the percentage of people in the tools system can become somewhat significant.

  If you bring up the fact that Amway products are expensive, then IBOFB will deflect it by bringing up Amway;s sales or winning some obscure product awards.

  These are some of the tactics that is commonly used by IBOFb and there are many examples of it on this very blog.

• I think that IBOFB has thrown in the Shamwow.
  He’s been bested.
  Worn down.
  Out-debated.
  Out-argued.
  Out-researched.
  Out-reasoned.
  And simply defeated.
  But ibofb should hold his head up high.
  There are no losers in blogging (except active IBOs).
  He spun and spun like a champion.
  But there’s only so much you can do when you’re wrong.
  His last words were “And with that, I am done. Ciao.”
  And with that, he yielded to Joecool.
  Long live IBOGaveUp!

  Even the late IBOFB acknowledged that most IBOs don’t do anything.
  The assumption here is that they are lazy or not committed to the hard work and commitment every successful endeavor requires.
  But what do others see as the reasons 95% bail out of Amway without wasting too much time or effort?
  Is it because they feel like douchebags selling stuff to Mom and Grandma?
  Is it because they notice everyone crosses the room or street when they approach?
  Is it because it dawns on them that they’ve been listening to Amway douchebags, meeting with Amway douchebags, and are on their way to becoming Amway douchebags?
  Could it be that they thought it would get more comfortable telling people they were in Amway, but it didn’t. And never will?
  Is it because the Ambotomy leaves a nasty scar?
  Could it be that they could not ingest any more of this Amway crap without heaving their guts out?
  What do you think?

  Maybe they came to the same conclusion that ibofb did: that their time would be better spent just digging holes in the ground and filling them with water.

• My friend was promised to be retired in 2 years after joining amway….. this is why I am little upset and he is trying to make it a full time job…. and I do own the building that my business is on. ibofightback in a non sarcastic way I applaud you that is quite a lot to do at 23 and i guess i haven’t been as ambitious as you were at 23…. so, with that said its time to do more…

• ibofightback i forgot to ask what sports team, which league, and what did you discover that is saving lives? I’m just curious….. and i own the land that both of my business are on, this is the answer to the question you asked.

• Some of you are so stupid, you gotta stay that way. Honestly, the people who post negative comments are just broke, busted, and discusted. You talk trash about people who are man or woman enough to step out of their comfort zone and do something for their family. All of you, i gaurantee got a whole lot of debt, marriage suck, and your kids dont ever want to be like you. You probably get off your dumb job and drink beer, and talk to your broke neighbors, friends, and family members who dont have no money about the one guy in the neighborhood who’s building his/her dream everyday. only champions understand consistent work ethic. Btw, you better be glad the owner of where you work had enough ballz to own a business, so you can be employed.

• You tell’m business owner! Theys so dumb they wasted all that time goin to skool and learnin ritin and ciphering and not bein champions like you and me. Uncle dad didn’t do him no book learnin and he got himself a double wide!

  you gonna make a gabillion dollars with amway cuz you think like a champion and aint nobody gwin care youse aliterit cuz you be rich rich rich!

• Business Owner, is it negative or is it the truth? A man could step up and start buying lottery tickets but it’s not a good idea if his family needs money. Why do some Amway folks discourage someone from getting a second job, as if that is a big problem? What’s wrong with being employed?

  As an Amway business owner, you are basically a commissioned salesperson. Amway is the business. You are just a distributor. You have a dispute with Amway and your business can be gone in a flash.

• Prior to reading the comments here I would just like to say I am not here to feud with anyone. I am just here as a person who likes to give his opinion and seek that of others. I am 23 and I was a part of this whole Amway thing but I quit on myself after just 2 months of being in the business. Why would a college student like me just quit? Well ok my life is not doing so well. I got family problems and things in my life that needed fixing so that was the main cause of me getting out but telling myself I might rejoin someday when I get my life back.

  That being said I thought long and hard about it. The meetings here are held every Tuesday night and I am simply too busy to do Amway. Am I calling this a scam? No not really but I will say if your getting into this business just know that to make any amount of money at all you need to work very hard and put in tons and tons of hours to see your profits start flowing in. The one thing that left me disappointed is the script they tell you on the phone to get you to sign up. I am not thinking this was a “get rich quick” thing but when my friend called to sign me up him and the Amway business person he was working with made it seem like it was the easiest thing in the world and like no effort was needed at all. I just wish they could have been upfront with me in telling me I was required to attend a meeting every single week and plus 2 out of state meetings.

  I get that it takes years to make money with this business. My problem is I don’t have connections to a lot of people. No one in my family believes in this so when I called to sign them up they all said no. I tried selling products to them and they still refused. I have very little friends so getting people to sign up under me was very hard considering they made me make a list of 40 people to sign up when I only have like 5 friends. Even in then only 3 of my friends showed interest only for 2 of them to call it a scam after and bail out on me.

  Am I saying you should not try Amway? No I am saying until you try you will not know if it is for you. But I will say Amway may be legit but it is not meant for everyone and I simply am so busy trying to pay my college tuition and bills working almost 50 hours and going to school at the same time that I do not have time to go to their meetings once a week and then out of state 2x a month. I found that selling products were not as easy as they made it seem to me so I struggled with that. Getting people to sign up under me was a nightmare because eventually I asked everyone I knew and not many people signed up and even in then out of the people that signed up like half quit.

  So in the end of my long review (assuming you read all the way to here) I will say Amway seems legit because I have heard stories of people who started there and can now say they are retired at a really early age. However whilest Amway seems legit it is not meant for everyone because you do need to put in loads of time and effort and with working 50 hours a week to pay my rent and bills and going to school (college) at the same time I did not have the time needed to dedicate myself to go meet people on the streets and try selling to them. You can do this if you want but you will soon realize that it takes a lot more time then you might have available and it might be a little more harder to do then the Amway people tell you it is. They always make it seem like a piece of cake when it is a lot harder then just that.

  Thanks for reading this review and good luck to those doing it. I may come back to it when I graduate school because I would have a better job hopefully by then and be able to work less hours if my degree works for me. Good luck everyone! :)

• Main article: In re Amway Corp.
  In a 1979 ruling,[14][77] the Federal Trade Commission found that Amway does not qualify as a pyramid scheme because distributors were not paid to recruit people and had to sell products to get bonus checks, and the company was committed to buying back its distributors’ excess inventory.[78]
  The FTC did, however, find Amway “guilty of price-fixing and making exaggerated income claims”;[79] the company was ordered to stop retail price fixing and allocating customers among distributors and was prohibited from misrepresenting the amount of profit, earnings or sales its distributors are likely to achieve with the business. Amway was ordered to accompany any such statements with the actual averages per distributor, pointing out that more than half of the distributors do not make any money, with the average distributor making less than $100 per month. The order was violated with a 1986 ad campaign, resulting in a $100,000 fine.[80][81] (Straight off wikipedia, you cannot make money off this, but you cannot convince these brainwashed cultivists that lol)

• Feel sorry for people like you son. I have 4 yrs in Amway and I already went to 20 States, plus I am making …yes I AM making $18,000dls a Month. can you do that? I bet you can.. Give yourself a chance and support people who wants to be better in life. Have an amazing day.

• joe:

  You are making more than $200K per year with Amway? That’s great! Finally someone posts who’s making money with Amway! (I think you’re the first in 800+ comments).

  What is your name and where are you based? Are you selling in all those states? Please give some more specifics about who you are and how you’ve achieved that in 4 years, as I’m sure the skeptics here will say you are full of BS. I’m sure Amway is touting your success story publicly anyway, so please share your last name.

  I’m sure your story will be inspirational and motivating to the young lad!

• SCAM SCAM AMWAY IS A SCAM!!

  So ok now that I have your attention with the above message I can say what I really wanted to say. I was on youtube and I saw a video by Dateline NBC where Chris Hansen did a whole special on Amway. What I want to know is if Amway is not a scam then how come he said it was? They are being investigated by the FBI and Better Business Bureau for fraud. From the people they interviewed and from what they can piece together most of the people who have made money on this Amway stuff are the recruiters who work for them trying to get you to sign up.

  Where does their income come from? They said 3 quarters of their income comes from seminars and from trying to sell people CDs and stuff. From what they said a very very small percentage of their money comes from Amway at all so all their expensive things they get they pay for using their seminars and CDs while Amway barely pays them a penny for this. So while the rest of us sit at their seminars listening to how to get rich someday and while we buy into their CDs with making money the only ones making money are the big shots who represent Amway.

  Dateline NBC even went to the Amway executives and asked about it and the executives declined to answer them and told them to leave. If Amway is not a scam then how come these big shot executives turned away Dateline NBC when asked about making most of their money from seminars and CDs only? If they really have nothing to hide and are as good as they say why not show proof with a check of some kind this way we know this really does work? Anyone who is asked for an interview but who declines seems suspicious to me and considering the fact they are being investigated by the FBI and BBB then it makes me suspicious about it even more.

  If they had nothing to hide and if Amway is as good as they seem it would make more sense to do the interview not tell Chris Hansen from NBC to leave their building. Just saying. My friend was right. He said show me a big money check from someone who claims they got rich from them and I will believe you and sign up. You all talk about making money and how Amway works great but where is your proof other then you commenting on this forum? Word of mouth is not enough to get someone to believe you is all I am saying. Show proof this way people can put their skepticism behind. I might go back but only because until I try it I wont know if it really works or not. But I wont go back till I have more time.

• John, you are right about what you are saying. Dateline infiltrated a BWW function and filmed an actual event. Amway refused to comment and later issued a propaganda based response. Bill Britt also refused comment. Some Amway defenders even tried to say Dateline staged the entire clip but they were wrong. Dateline was spot on.

  The insidious thing about Amway is that there are two businesses running side by side. You have Amway and the products with a (IMO) crappy compensation plan which is unfair to new IBOs. Then you have the tool companies like BWW or Network 21 who are for profit tool companies who sell motivation and training. The tool companies make money even if you fail and/or lose your shirt.

  Amway supplies the products and the products bonuses. The tool companies in turn, recruit IBOs, teach product loyalty and they in turn get to sell cds and convention tickets to the Amway IBOs.

  The problem I see is that Amway appears to have turned a blind eye to the tool company abuse of downline. Amway defenders like to minimize the situation but the internet is littered with people’s bad experiences and horror stories associated with Amway and the tool companies.

• Joecool-

  I wanted to say thanks for the response. Sorry if I was being a bit nosey here but I clicked on the link on your screen name as I was curious and it took me to that amway blog. I wanted to say fantastic blog. Very detailed and gave lots of info I was looking for on Amway.

  My question to you if you don’t mind me asking is how long have you been with Amway? I am assuming you were the one who made this blog? Or was it just one you found online? I am curious how long you have been working with Amway for to not see the rewards they promised?

  Also why do you suppose that so many people like the IBO’s who do Amway defend Amway so much if in fact Amway is something that does not work or pay much? Would you say it is safe to say that these multiples of people who defend Amway saying they are not a scam and that it works could be big shot executives who work for Amway and are being paid to say nice things about them? Could these people who defend Amway be millionaires who host those seminars and sell the CD’s to make the big bucks?

  Reason I ask all that is because it seems strange to me that someone would go to extreme lengths to defend a company who barely pays them a cent and say all these nice things when they have seen nothing positive come out of their work except a very tiny paycheck that I could get working at a McDonalds or something. To me seems like either Amway pays them to say nice things about them and defend their company but say they don’t work for Amways office. Or they are the big shot millionaire executives who work for Amway and scam us into this.

  But all in all I have to agree with everything your saying here. Thanks for the insight and details and for the blog post. Take care for now :)

• Hi John,

  Yes, that is my blog. I was in Amway over ten years ago. I was at 4000 PV and I did everything my upline advised but I didn’t make any money. I would have made a little profit if not for having to travel long distance to functions.

  I made the blog because I wanted to share my experiences and warn unsuspecting prospects about some of the lies and deceit commonly used to paint the business as a rosy when when in fact, the real business for many is selling tools and function tickets rather than Amway.

  Amway is odd in that it creates loyalty. Even people not making money or people losing their shirts seemingly defend Amway with a passion. I don’t know why. I guess because they have hopes of retiring at the age of 29 and walking the beaches of the world. If they accept that Amway isn’t all that, their dreams and hopes are dashed. I suppose it’s possible that Amway pays PR people to infiltrate blogs and forums to defend Amway but it could also be brainwashed rank and file IBOs.

  I’m glad my blog was helpful to you and hopefully to many others. Thanks for the kind words.

• @Joecool
  I love reading all your comments. I love how many have backed down from your debate because they simply cannot compete or give enough facts to support yours. I am on this blog because I have seen so many friends lost to some kind of scheme.

  I didn’t know much about the Amway scheme except some things I have seen on television but didn’t pay much attention to, (all negative) but yesterday my intelligence was questioned by and “IBO” and it really offended me, for it was someone whom I’ve been acquainted with for a while. When I told him I was not interested in any kind of “get rich” pyramid type scheme he became very offended and devilish toward me which was very offensive in my opinion. I saw that cult like behavior mentioned! I then told him that he’s known me for a while and I am a strong minded independent, hard working person with a family and I simply do not want to throw money away I have too many priorities and people that depend on me (after all if might as well take my money and put it thru the paper shredder as opposed to giving it to be wasted by Amway supporters anyways) needless to say he got in my face asking a little and stormed out the door like a bat out of hell.

  I would also like you to touch on some other scam’s if you don’t mind joecool? It seems Boresha skinny coffee has become abroad in my town, some people I know are getting into it and acting the same way. I know its another “pyramid” typed scheme, could you touch on it any and discuss what you may know about them?
  Thanks Bunches

• Hi Jarrod,

  Thanks for your nice comments. I appreciate it and it certainly is my reward for blogging and commenting on various forums. I’m glad you have seen through the Amway tactics used by some people.

  Sorry to say I don’t know anything about Boresha Skinny Coffee, but a google search might yield some information.

• I wanted to post this, thought it was pretty relevant

  Ponzi/Pyramid Scheme Warning Signs
  By: Bill E. Branscum
  Copyright 2002

  As with any investment, advise your Clients to carefully evaluate any prospect promising unusually high returns and/or a multilevel marketing opportunity and:

  Avoid any program they must pay to join where they are promised a commission based upon their success in recruiting investors or a “downline.”

  Avoid plans requiring the purchase of expensive products and marketing materials (often called tools).

  Be highly skeptical of plans involving miracle products or promising enormous earnings at no, or low, risk.

  Beware of shills – “decoy” references paid by a plan’s promoter to lie about their earnings through the plan.

  Decline to pay for anything, or sign any contracts, in pressure-filled situations. If they have already committed, have them send the promoter a written notice of their intent to cancel as soon as possible.

  Be diligent in checking claims, backgrounds, references and use the governmental resources available to potential investors like the State Office of the Attorney General, the State Division of Securities, the NASD and the Better Business Bureau wherever they are based.

  Always get information about the investment in writing before investing. Any legitimate investment opportunity should have an offering circular with specific, detailed information about the company and the investment.

  If the promoter claims that the information is too complicated to understand, or that time is of the essence, pick another investment opportunity.

  Do not believe in “secret” strategies, proprietary programs, or any other mysterious offering – nobody should ever invest in anything they do not understand.

  Never, ever, attempt to get clever with the IRS – by all means, they should protect their assets, but it is insane to entrust their future to some Internet huckster promising tax relief. The mere appearance of criminality may result in a federal prosecution that will ruin them, whether they are ultimately convicted or not.

  Remember that no matter how good a product, and how solid a multilevel marketing plan may appear to be, there is no, “free lunch.”

  Here is the website for it, is has a total breakdown of every scheme including Amway
  http://www.fraudsandscams.com/warnings.htm

• I don ‘t think Amway is a scam but two or three things nauseate me about it’s more arrogant supporters
  – Stop considering yourself superior to those who work for somebody else Just because you run your own business and are rich,does not mean you are a better person than someone who does not do what you do.I have lived relatively well working as a teacher and don’t consider myself an inferior human being,just because the daddies of some of my students earn more than I do.In fact,judging by the behavior of some of their offspring at times, they would seem to be awful unhappy people. why would anyone in their right mind want to be rich like them?Amway boosters seem to put themselves in same category, and apparently onlycondescend to talk to us, because they want to sell us something.
  I went to Amway seminar many years ago,bought some product, and decided I had other priorities than sell Amway. the convener of the seminar did not convince me, because being a teacher, I tend to get too critical of amateur preachers and salesmen using bad teaching techniques which is what many salesmen in the real business world,not only Amway use.There are things you cannot learn from tapes.It seemed to me that people making the real money were the people running the seminars, and not the people at bottom of the pyramid selling the product.
  I do not consider that I am an inferior person because I decided not to make myself rich by promoting their products, so I don’t see why I have to be constantly scolded for missing a golden opportunity to get rich when I just don’t damn care.

  Amway is just another product, not a superior one, and it is not a religion,unless you call selling soft soap literally a religion. Amway zealots need to get a life, and stop wasting their valuable time when they could be boosting their sales,by writing long tedious boring posts on websites,nitpicking at tiny points of criticism made by people who are never going to believe what they say anyway.it is no wonder that some people find them infuriating.

• As far as I know, Amway business in China is even more tragic and evil because the prices of the products are usually 3-5 times higher than those you can find in stores. Amway people claim that they are foreign “luxurious” goods of “superior quality”. Sigh :(

• For some people being independently rich, and having done it themselves,makes them feel great and superior to poor old Joe Dirt who has to work his whole life for somebody else to earn a living. For some people being in Amway, and being a supposedly successful entrepreneur, makes them feel they have a right to talk down to the rest of us because we are not like them. They also seem to think we care about Amway so much that they write very long,long,tedious,boring posts defending it against sometimes nit picking criiticisms.In writing these posts they seem to be showing how much spare time they now have,but surely they can find something more useful and enjoyable to do with their time,I would.

  Fact- Amway is a business like any other and the fact that some of its promoters earn more money does not make them more intelligent than anyone else. It just shows their priorities were about making money,and they had the right set of circumstances to be successful. There are probably better,easier and still legal ways of running a successful business than selling and promoting Amway. As this company Amway business practices are similar to most others, so there is no need to carry on about like a bunch of crazy religious fanatics trying to defend its every mistake.

  I am willing to bet that, despite their religious zeal,when I go to Hell there will be more succssful Amway entrepreneurs there than in Heaven.

• I’m still in recovery from my recent experience with Amway! Do you know how long did it take me to feel this way? One day! I recently met a couple with a kid in the park, while I was with my 7 years old daughter. They appeared to be very happy, positive and really liked me. Well, we exchanged the numbers and here we are, we are friends! One day they called me and said that they wanted to discuss a business opportunity. I met up with them and they went over it very briefly and when I asked if it was Amway, they didn’t answer….
  They convinced me to go with them to the centre and stupid me, I went. When we arrived, I saw Amway name on the building, I thought or NO! They practically opened my bag to join this cult! They made sure, that I came with them in their car and let me tell you, I felt trapped!
  Amway is a scam, not to mention it’s a cult, some sort of scary religion. People are so brainwashed and totally possessed.
  Historical facts about Amway:
  China banned Amway as a multi level plan, allowing them to operate only as a retail shops, as they are treating the concept as FRAUD!!!
  People lost money, friends and family.
  99% of all Amway sales people never earn even one penny of profit! These are the facts, not a theory, or an opinion!
  THE GREATEST FACTOR SUSTAINING AMWAY IS NOT SALES, SINCE IT HAS NO CUSTOMERS, ONLY A REVOLVING GROUP OF FAILED SALES PEOPLE!!!
  Lastly, products are average and extremely expensive!
  Someone earlier posted a brilliant comment: Your garage will be filled with detergent and you will have no friends, or a family!
  It happened to me two days ago and I’m still boiling! These people, didn’t just robed me of my sunday, they also violated me!!!
  Who ever thinks this is the way to make a fortune are sadly mistaking…..
  I do hope someone who is thinking to join, read some stories, as I would hate to see people investing time, money, heart, saul and health into this!

• i shouldnt waste my time trying to explain to you ignorant people that amway is not a scam. just a few things though
  1 if you become an ibo and you dont do shit, dont expect to get any profits. if you dont do what you are supposed to it becomes an expense rather than an investment
  2 if you have never experienced it yourself, then you have no foundation and no right to say if it works or not.
  3 if you are not smart enough to understand the amway bussiness plan, then you probably wont benefit from it because you are to dumb to do it.
  4 to make money in amway you must develop leadership skills, but some people are naturally followers so they will get to a point where they get stucked beacause of lack of leadership
  5 you determine through your work, how much you earn and how quick you earn it.
  6 the lowest pin in amway: platinums, make more money than an average american. and a ibo with a high pin such as me. i make the equivalent to 2 years of income of an average person in only 1 month, because i put the work in =).
  7 if you become an ibo, dont expect things to be easy, or fast. the amount of REAL work you put in will determine your paycheck.

  for those people who are against amway, i wish you luck working 40+ hours per week for about 50 years of your life, to retire with a pension just enough to get you through rest of your tired lives, have fun using those credit cards and building up more and more debts, after all they give you a sense of “status ” right?

  mediocre people will always be mediocre. but just because you are miserable doesnt mean others have to be miserable like you. =)

  give yourselves a chance, failure is all part of success.

• @OA9
  While agreeing with you that amway is not a scam,this is a typical example of how you rich ibos talk down arrogantly to the rest of us,as though we are inferiorIf you learnt to communicate better,you might convince us.
  at 64 years of age with an indexed pension,I don’t have to work but choose to do so.If I was an ibo I would still be having to work to earn the same amount of money, and then would still be taking the risk of getting no profit at all. Good luck to you then, and As I said in a previous post,frankly who cares what you think. I can now afford to look down my nose at stuck up little capitalists slaving away running their own businesses for forty or more hours a week to get rich.

  as an Australian,I don’t have to accept that the American Way or Amway is the key to sucess.When I read the insults written in a post like this, I am glad I was not born an arrogant,ugly inferior American, like so many of you who think for no apparent
  Reason that your way of life is superior to the rest of the world.

  reason that you know better than the rest of the world.

• OA9, Bless you for visiting with us peasants! We are so glad you have Internet access on your yacht!

  “i shouldnt waste my time trying to explain to you ignorant people that amway is not a scam…”
  Thank you for donating your precious time to the unenlightened rabble! We know your time would be better wasted memorizing Amway clichés and nonsequitors..

  “1 if you become an ibo and you dont do shit, dont expect to get any profits.”
  True! Though if you don’t do shit, you’ll make about the same as the hardworking Ambots that DO do shit… plus your family and friends won’t hate you more than they already do.

  “2 if you have never experienced it yourself, then you have no foundation and no right to say if it works or not.”
  Yes, and if you have never stuck your head in an open flame or stepped in front of a speeding truck, you have no foundation or right to say it’s unwise. By all means, give either of those a shot, OA9!

  “3 if you are not smart enough to understand the amway bussiness plan, then you probably wont benefit from it because you are to dumb to do it.”
  Yes, if you are too dumb to see that your annoying neighbor with his garage full of unsold amway crap has a much smarter business plan than dumb old Wal Mart, you are destined to live the nightmare of regular, direct deposit paychecks, paid vacation and sick days and health insurance. Think how miserable you’ll be in paid retirement with a nice car in your garage instead of unsold and decrepit Amway crap.

  “4 to make money in amway you must develop leadership skills, but some people are naturally followers so they will get to a point where they get stucked beacause of lack of leadership”
  And by leadership, we mean being able to memorize and recite (with a straight face) Ambot clichés like “mediocre people will always be mediocre.” And “give yourselves a chance, failure is all part of success.” And “the amount of REAL work you put in will determine your paycheck.”
  Amway believes the real symbol of leadership is the Parrot.

  “5 you determine through your work, how much you earn and how quick you earn it.”
  And every time a bell rings, a fairy gets her wings…!

  “6 the lowest pin in amway: platinums, make more money than an average american. and a ibo with a high pin such as me. i make the equivalent to 2 years of income of an average person in only 1 month, because i put the work in =).”
  The average median yearly wage in the US is $26,364. OA9 is claiming he/she makes $316,000 PROFIT from Amway each year. We believe you, sure! And I bet you can’t disclose your identity for some reason, but be assured we’ll just take your word for it cuz you talk so big you must be rich!

  “7 if you become an ibo, dont expect things to be easy, or fast. the amount of REAL work you put in will determine your paycheck.”
  Except that you won’t get a paycheck. Paychecks are for wage slaves, remember?

  “for those people who are against amway, i wish you luck working 40+ hours per week for about 50 years of your life,”
  Yeah, who ever got ahead by WORKING a job, getting paid and supporting a family? Suckers!

  “to retire with a pension just enough to get you through rest of your tired lives, have fun using those credit cards and building up more and more debts, after all they give you a sense of “status right?”
  Losers don’t realize that REAL status comes with cool names like “Diamonds” and “Platinums” and “Emeralds.” REAL status comes with cool PINS and having your own secret language, and scamming enough people with fake water filters and bogus supplements so Amway gives you a free decoder ring and a pat on the head!

  “mediocre people will always be mediocre.”
  You got that right.

  “but just because you are miserable doesnt mean others have to be miserable like you. =)”
  Why be miserable when you can bathe in the warmth of self-delusion and unwarranted self-righteousness, like OA9?

  “give yourselves a chance, failure is all part of success.”
  And with Amway, you will surely achieve that part of success called failure. Guaranteed!

• Correction to #6: The average median yearly wage in the US is $26,364. OA9 is claiming he/she makes $632,000 PROFIT from Amway each year
  (The greedrenaline coursing through my veins affected my math skills for a moment! OA9 is actually 2x as successful as I had said!)

• Petery wrote: “I am glad I was not born an arrogant,ugly inferior American, like so many of you who think for no apparent reason that your way of life is superior to the rest of the world.”

  OK, back up there, Aussie. I mean, mate. Australia (Van Dieman’s land) has generated and exported its share of crooks and arrogant swindlers. Your penal colony started as the dumping ground for criminals unfit for English prisons. No wonder Australia produced most franchise business coaching scams like ActionCoach and Mars Venus Coaching. Google “Brad Sugars” and tell me about moneygrubbing Americans. Try Jumping J-Jays and John Newton. Australia is rife with franchise and biz opp scams, which they export to the US asap cuz of our big-buck investors like OA9.

  While I am certainly not proud of the damage the US has inflicted on the world, particularly through Jersey Shore, Real Housewives, everything Kardashian and George W. Bush (please accept my apologies on behalf of the USA, everyone), the country that gave us Crocodile Dundee, the Wiggles, Olivia Newton John, Mel Gibson and the term “Crikey!” shouldn’t throw stones!

  Let’s put aside our differences and unite in our common ridicule of OA9 and Amway.

  Amway does not equal “The American Way” any more than Outback Steakhouse equals the Australian way of live.

  Your mate, Guest

  PS is “Fosters” REALLY Australian for “be-ah?”

• So now your saying Amway is not a scam? For someone who is such a big defender of amway I see no proof here. You talk a lot of gibberish for me to believe you. If you want to prove yourself simply post a picture of the check you claim to have made and I will shut my mouth up right now once and for all.

  But if you have no proof other then your word of mouth then I will say you are just making up all that stuff cause you have no proof. Here is the deal. I understand their business and their plan. That is why I spent numerous hours every week going to all their meetings and meeting with their people and trying to sell the plan to others.

  in fact I know a guy who is in this business spending almost half of what he makes a paycheck in amway investments and he has been with them for about 5 years now and has not made a decent check. He is still making pennies on the dollar and he has done everything the amway people have asked him. He followed the plan and he knows it so well he could tell you the whole thing word for word from how well he knows how to sell the plan.

  Yet here he is working 40 hours a week to support himself because even though he does Amway it never kicked in like they promised. Yet if Amway works why is America in such big debt? Why are millions of Americans not doing this and instead having to rely on a president who does not help us at all? Yes exactly what I thought.

  Even Chris Henson from Dateline NBC called this a scam on the show once and everyone saw the proof on the show. When they asked Amway why so many people are putting in the work and not making the money Amway promised them after a few years Amway refused to answer and in fact Chris Henson and his crew were asked to leave the amway building. They did further investigation to find out only people who run the seminars are rich millionaires scamming you into paying $300+ just so they can get money and half those people are amway big shot executives themselves not IBO.

  I know the system and did the work yet here I am not making anything more then I make at my day job. You talk a lot of gibberish but I do not buy your pitch sir. If you have a check you can post a picture of for proof then I will believe you and shut my mouth right now. But until I see a check I stand firm that Amway is a scam. You have no proof other then your word of mouth.

• ok, I totally agree with you, but I have never heard of some of the so called Aussie scams you mention.It does not bother me Whether you like those second rate Aussie performers who make it big in America, as most of those you listed apart from The wiggles ceased to be Australians long ago, when they all made it big in the American marketplace, like Rupert Murdoch.I assume for tax reasons and for work reasons, they felt more comfortable with living in America and being American
  I am not intending to feud with anyone over whether Australia or America produces more scammers, that is a stupid argument.Almost as stupid as Arguing over Amway.
  I read in Wikipedia that Amway is short for American Way and can you imagine the bad message that sends to people overseas when they realize that,given the arrogant boofheads

• That they send out to promote it. (see above)
  (boofhead is a nice Aussie colloquial expression for a certain kind of person The dictionary in my I pad would not accept it for a real word, and so stuffed up my message above I suggest you use it discreetly against Amway supporters.They will never have heard of it, and get touchy when someone reminds them they don’t know everything

• just to make my meaning clear,the original Boofhead was an Australian comic strip character of about fifty years ago.He had about half the IQ of Beavis and Butthead combined,but was a bit more lovable.

• Petery:
  Boofhead! That’s a great name for them!
  Not sure if “boofing” or “getting boofed” has the same slang connotations down under, but in the U.S. its slang for, how can I say it… rear entry? And not always consensually.
  So Boofhead is a fitting term for those who keep getting boofed by Amway yet keep showing up for more, keep paying out for meetings and DVDs, and keep fiercely defending those who are doing the boofing.
  OK, I officially take back everything bad I said about Australia.
  In exchange for the term “Boofhead,” all is forgiven.

• Yes I had to think for a moment here to really understand your messages. About the whole seminars and meetings thing hey we are just doing what we are told by Amway. They say if you expect to make money or become successful in this Amway business then you have to go to the seminars and pay because they teach you a lot about how to make the most profits.

  Yet when I did that here I am not making anything. I make more money at my day job then I make with Amway. Just like when you get a new job you don’t know what your doing until they teach you and someone trains you on how to do. If you do the job right that’s when you get paid for your work. Amway is almost the same because they tell you what and how to do things and if you do it your supposed to get paid. The only difference between amway and a job out there is that with a real job you do the job correctly and get paid.

  With Amway you do the job and do it right but instead of getting the big money they promised you in a few years you end up with barely a paycheck from them and I do everything I am told by the Amway people step by step hoping to get the money I was told. Yet here I am putting in more hours into Amway then I probably need to and yet I don’t see the results. Surely if Amway was not a scam millions of Americans more would be into doing this business and we would not be all sitting here saying when is the economy for the US going to get any better.

  If Amway does work surely all the other countless websites and videos I have seen of people doing this well someone would have posted proof like a picture of their check or something so I can see that it works. All I see is a ton of people who promote and defend amyway hoping to see that it works when they get nothing out of them.

• MY SPECIFIC RESPONSE TO OA9!!!!

  I can see you are a typical ignorant, angry, most likely uneducated person.
  You are wishing me a good luck with working for the next 40 years???
  Ok, my family have money, I was just lucky to be born in that kind of family and I DON’T have to work at all, but choose to, as I like it and want for my daughter to see that people should work. I’m also doing my 3rd degree and I’m very down to earth person.
  Why is that all the possessed (can’t think of a better word) members of AMWAY are so angry? I bet because they already know that they are a losers, but too scared to admit it to themselves.
  World will never change. There are NO QUICK WAYS TO MAKE MONEY, UNLESS YOU ARE A GENIUS! Education and hard work, that is the only way you can get somewhere.
  I WISH YOU ALL THE LUCK WITH DISCOVERING YOURSELF WHAT IS AMWAY ALL ABOUT….
  In the mean time, keep your anger down…..

• I addtion…..

  How primitive all those names? Dimonds, Emiralds, Platinum….

  Designed for a very primitive and little mind like OA9!

• Guys if you want to try something similar to amway but with low prices and a 29, dollar membership call me at [redacted] the company name its melaleuca and here u don’t have to sell products just the membership and people buys them because its only 29.00. And they have lower prices that stores have give me a call at [redacted] I sign in 2 friends that were at amway and now they are with melaleuca