COVERALL Franchise Complaints

188 thoughts on “COVERALL Franchise Complaints”

• The last time I went to a janitorial supply store I met a man that had a cleaning franchise with coverall. He said it was the worst mistake of his life and that his accounts were paying less than minimum wage. He also told me about another man that he knew who had lost his house because of Coverall.

• Please read the following article that came out in the New York Times David Segal The Haggler 12-27-2009

  The Haggler
  In Search of Work, but at What Cost?

  By DAVID SEGAL
  Published: December 26, 2009

  STILL in holiday peace-and-goodwill mode? Aww. How sweet!

  Just a quick bit of advice: Read something else.

  Seriously, beat it, O.K.? Because Christmas is so two days ago, and in this episode we are going to dive into the dark heart of the janitorial franchise world — which turns out to be really, really dark.

  Q . I am writing on behalf of my housekeeper, Jagoda Walczak, a Polish immigrant who has been cleaning homes for years. She thought she could find new clients by investing in a franchise called Coverall Cleaning.

  She borrowed $17,600 from her brother and friends to cover the franchise fee, and Coverall guaranteed that it would send her $5,000 worth of commercial cleaning business — basically janitorial services for offices — every month. They assure people that they can make $18 to $20 an hour with these accounts. More than three months later, she had been offered less than $2,500 worth of business, and the monthly payments for these jobs were so low that, calculated at an hourly rate, they were minimum wage.

  She tried to get her money back, but Coverall will not send her a refund. Is there any way the Haggler can help?

  Channa Steinberg

  New York City

  A . The commercial cleaning franchise world is a new one to the Haggler, but it’s been around since the mid-1970s, and Coverall is just one of several national players.

  It works like this: You give Coverall a big fat check and it provides training, some start-up supplies and initial leads to companies in need of cleaning service. The goal is steady income from cleaning gigs that are serviced, ideally, with your own employees.

  In theory, it’s not a bad idea, and the company, which is based in Boca Raton, Fla., says it has 8,000 franchisees servicing 50,000 customers in the United States. It also has a pretty lengthy record of settling lawsuits brought by former Coverall franchisees — more than two dozen suits since 1998, according to its 2008 franchise disclosure document, with one settlement as high as $450,000. In every instance, the company denies wrongdoing.

  Read through a summary of the complaints, and themes emerge. Again and again, franchisees allege that Coverall presented them with a job at a set fee that required so much time and/or additional employees that the income, per hour, was a pittance.

  Shannon Liss-Riordan, a lawyer in Boston who has filed a class-action lawsuit against Coverall, says that this is standard operating procedure.

  “Companies like Coverall are competing for commercial cleaning contracts against regular janitorial companies that pay their workers as employees, which means they pay worker’s compensation and have to abide by minimum-wage laws,” she says. “Using the independent contractor model, Coverall doesn’t have to worry about any of that, so they underbid for contracts and obviously the person who gets hurt is the worker.”

  Ms. Walczak says she was offered a job cleaning a Vidal Sassoon salon — six nights a week — for just over $1,300 a month. A Coverall manager gave her a tour of the premises and said the whole job should take two and a half hours an evening. It took five hours, minimum, Ms. Walczak said she discovered. After three weeks, she told Coverall that the job was financially unfeasible.

  When she demanded her money back, Coverall refused and suggested that she sell her franchise. Ultimately, she was paid less than $700 for all of her Coverall-related work, including the three weeks at that Sassoon salon.

  A spokeswoman for Coverall, Jacqueline Vlaming, sent a lengthy e-mail message in response to the Haggler’s inquiries about Ms. Walczak. In it, Ms. Vlaming says that the company doesn’t guarantee $5,000 worth of cleaning jobs a month, but instead promises an initial set of jobs worth that sum of money, after which you’re basically on your own.

  She also said that Ms. Walczak declined nine perfectly good cleaning gigs — worth $7,000, altogether — and that the Sassoon salon is now serviced by another Coverall franchisee for the same fee that Ms. Walczak found inadequate.

  “Ms. Walczak was difficult to work with from the outset,” Ms. Vlaming wrote. “We tried repeatedly to explain to her the methodology inherent in bidding commercial accounts. She simply did not want to hear it.”

  For a competing perspective, we turn to Steven Cumbow, a former chief financial officer at Coverall who has left the company and was recently deposed by Ms. Liss-Riordan as part of her class-action lawsuit.

  “Coverall has built its business around charging individuals — many of whom are non-English speakers — thousands of dollars in exchange for a promise that it will provide paid cleaning work,” a court document says, paraphrasing Mr. Cumbow’s deposition. “Instead of supplying this business, however, Coverall utilizes a ‘churning’ model whereby it offers business to workers who, Coverall knows, will be unable to accept or to adequately service the account, or revokes business for pretextual reasons.”

  Ms. Vlaming called Mr. Cumbow a “disgruntled terminated employee with a grudge.”

  The Haggler spoke to Ms. Walczak last week, and she described her struggles to make a living and provide for two teenage children. “I called the company and I just cried,” she said. “I told them: ‘You lied to me. You said I could make money and I can’t and now I’m borrowing money and I’m in a worse situation than before.’”

  See? The Haggler warned you that this is not a feel-good story. But in the e-mail message, Ms. Vlaming said Coverall would be willing to discuss Ms. Walczak’s situation with her and to “work toward a solution.” The Haggler will follow those discussions and report on their outcome in a forthcoming column.

  E-mail: haggler@nytimes.com. Keep it brief and family-friendly, and go easy on the caps-lock key. Letters may be edited for clarity and length.

  http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/27/your-money/27haggler.html?_r=1

• Pingback: Commercial Cleaning Franchise Complaints : Unhappy Franchisee

• I have been in the janitorial industry for over ten years. I have heard many similar complaints. I always feel sorry for someone when they are wronged by a franchise. It seems that all the franchises have problems. Good Luck.

• Coverall has took my money and didnt find me any accounts. and i went and paid for additional accounts. Is there anyway i can get a refund? Dont buy a franchise from coverall they dont help you when you need help.

• I have been in the janitorial industry for over ten years. I have heard many similar complaints. I always feel sorry for someone when they are wronged by a franchise. It seems that all the franchises have problems. Good Luck.

• I read the following article and thought I would share it . The Coverall Trial begins in May. Lets all say a prayer so that all of those people who got Ripped-off and hurt by Coverall finally get Justice.

  Federal Judge: Franchising Sounds Like Ponzi Scheme
  Posted Thu, 2010/04/01 – 19:12 by Corbin Williston
  Is franchising “a modified Ponzi scheme?” Last week, a federal judge said it might be.

  Janitorial franchises have long been a source of embarrassment for the franchise industry, and frequently attract purchasers with few assets and poor command of English.

  A 2001 report by the GAO on FTC enforcement of the Franchise Rule found that from 1993-2000, Coverall violations had affected 2591 investors, and JaniKing violations affected 900 investors.
  A 2005 news article in the NY Times noted complaints by Brazilian immigrant franchisees of Coverall in Boston, and a settlement of Coverall litigation in Los Angeles in which franchisees alleged fraud.
  An August 2009 interview with Franchise Times quoted Coverall making this claim:
  Jacqueline Vlaming, Coverall’s general counsel, said, “Every franchise owner who runs it like a business can make money.”

  In the most recent lawsuit, Pius Awuah and 10 other franchisees relate similar stories:

  1.They paid Coverall North America a “franchise fee” in exchange for which
  2.They were promised a minimum dollar amount of client accounts to service each month.
  3.Coverall entered into the contract with the clients and billed the clients.
  4.Coverall assigned the franchisees to clean the client premises, and
  5.Coverall would remit money to the franchisees after deducting various charges.
  The franchisees alleged in their Complaint that they were never given the amount of business they had been promised, and that the degree of control which Coverall exercised over them meant that as a matter of Massachusetts law that they were really employees of Coverall.

  After filing suit, the franchisee attorneys uncovered damaging information and Coverall moved to seal court documents. In an interlocutory appeal, a 3 judge panel of the 1st Circuit Court of Appeals said in October 2009:

  Coverall has been charged–it has not been found liable in this case–with activities that could be viewed as highly unattractive[cite omitted]

  It is not necessarily the disclosure to competitors that makes the district court’s order a matter of concern. Others, including enforcement agencies and potential plaintiffs, may find the disclosures of interest in ways that would not serve Coverall’s interests. [emphasis underlined in original]

  The lawsuit continued and on March 23, 2010 the District Court ruled in favor of the “franchisee” plaintiffs, holding that they are in fact employees.

  What has attracted attention within the franchise community is the Judge’s comments about Coverall’s assertion that its business was actually the sale of franchises. Traditionally industry trade groups such as the IFA have maintained that franchising is not an industry but rather a business model (although the IFA has on other occasions defined franchising as an industry).

  Judge Young stated:

  Describing franchising as a business in itself, as Coverall seeks to do, sounds vaguely like a description for a modified Ponzi scheme – a company that does not earn money from the sale of goods and services, but from taking in more money from unwitting franchisees to make payments to previous franchisees.

  The Judge went on to say that he believed that in fact Coverall was in the business of janitorial services and that under Massachusetts law the “franchisees” were really employees of Coverall. But the use of the term “Ponzi scheme” and the interlocutory ruling have caused this case to gain wide attention.

  An interesting issue raised by franchise law firm Nixon Peabody is the impact of the Massachusetts statute and case law on post-term non-compete clauses.

  The IFA issued a press release criticizing the ruling as a threat to franchising in Massachusetts. As far back as 1998, the IFA took the (then) unheard-of step and filed an amicus brief opposing a janitor who filed for unemployment after being fired from his job at West Sanitation Services. (Matter of Francis, 688 N.Y.S.2d 55)

  A bigger threat to Coverall might be the bad publicity which has caused it to lose contracts with Boston-area clients such as Legal Sea Foods and Cheescake Factory (NASDAQ: CAKE). Both restaurants paid Coverall, but the mostly Hispanic cleaning staff did not get paid.

  Coverall said it had properly sent money to the Boston “franchisee” and that it bore no responsibility for seeing that the workers were paid. After media reports, Coverall paid the wages. Legal Sea Foods terminated Coverall due to concerns about worker mistreatment, Cheescake Factory terminated Coverall due to a number of concerns, and the Massachusetts Attorney General is investigating the janitorial industry, according to the Boston Globe.

• It looks like a new Lawsuit has been filled against coverall.

  This also looks like its another class action.

  Laguna V coverall

  It was filled in San Diego, California in late 2009

  I think this lawsuit has 50 people in it.

• 1st amendment: Well let’s hope Liz and her crack pot team of lawyers that screwed “aiwah” and attempted to “down play” their loss as a “test case” don’t cause these people to lose 200K. Don’t you feel at least a little “guilty” I mean, its really on your head as you continued to “pimp your attorney” all over the internet and their first big “decision” is a 200K flop!!!!!

  Way to go “guest” and 1st amendment, with friends like you, bankruptcy judges throughout the country as well as “attorneys” everywhere will be screaming your names from the tallest mountain!!!!

• To jerry who is working for the cleaning franchisors and getting paid alot of money $$$

  I just went to this website and saw over 25 Lawsuits against coverall.

  Something has to be very wrong if a company has that many Lawsuits.

  I wonder how many more got settled under the table that we never heard of.

  I wonder how many people got ripped-off and never got justice.

  I will post there lawsuits in order here is the first one.

  Jesus H, Castro and Herschand Co. v. The Kover Group. Inc. dba Coverall of South Florida. Mauro R. Guerra. individually, and Management Risk Group.iFinancial Corp.. (Circuit Court of the 11th Judicial Circuit in and for Dade County, Florida, Case No. 97-8090-CA21), filed April 11, 1997. Plaintiffs allege breach of contract, rescission of contract and fraudulent misrepresentation. They claim they purchased a franchise and were not provided the appropriate amount of business. The plaintiffs claim damages in excess of $100,000. We have denied all allegations of wrongdoing. The plaintiffs filed an Amended Complaint in November 1997. The case was settled on August 24, 2007, and Coverall agreed to pay the Plaintiffs $20,000.

• 1st amendment: Never said that Coverall was perfect. No company is perfect. Of course you don’t understand any of that, nor do you want to. You’ve been “in the business” for less than a year. You think you know everything about this business, point of fact, YOU DON”T.

  You can “hate” Jan-Pro, but you have no business speaking on any other issue, most of your issues at Jan-Pro have been disproven by me and verified by others. Problem with you and “guest” you just start “spewing” and until recently, no one countered what you are “spewing”.

  You still claim that I’m being paid by Jan-Pro now all of a sudden, I must be being paid by Coverall and Jani-King as well. Well, here it is again, I”m not, no one is paying me to “post” on this site, no one is paying me “review” on this site, no one is paying me anything in regards to this site. Just doing what needs to be done, giving the “other side” of the argument. FREE of CHARGE and without being part of any of the “Big 3”.

• “To jerry who is working for the cleaning franchisors and getting paid alot of money $$$”

  1st Amendment:

  There’s no way these companies are paying Jerr-Bear for publicly embarrassing them and keeping this conversation going.

  If they are going to part with their scam-dollars, they’re going to get someone with some PR skills. This guy’s a clown who’s huffed a little too much solvent over the years.

  Second, they don’t really care what’s said about them. They’ve got enough recent immigrants, non-English speakers, non-computer users and other trusting souls to hoodwink.

  If anybody’s paying Jerry it’s the anti-janitorial scam people, paying Jerr-bear to make their adversaries look stupid. And boy are they are getting their money’s worth!

• Guest: Oh you are so Special, so Witty, so Funny. I’ve stated all along, not getting paid, stated all along don’t have “skin” in this game. But again, you and 1st amendment don’t read. You just “blather on” making false statements, trying to state them as “facts”

  I thought you’d want the conversation to continue. Per you, they hate me, you hate me, the illegal immigrants hate me, what do you care about what I say so much?

  Funny, I’ve posted my thoughts here, been honest with who I am, where I came from, what positions I’ve held in this industry, you can’t even be honest with “who you are”.

• “I’ve posted my thoughts here, been honest with who I am”
  Really? Your name is really Jerry? What’s your last name? What’s the name of your employer? Again, you contradict yourself so openly. Give your real, verifiable name or stop pretending you’ve disclosed your identity.

  “Per you, they hate me, you hate me, the illegal immigrants hate me”
  Never said anyone hates you. Again, blatant falsehood.

  “I thought you’d want the conversation to continue”
  I love your comments! I’m trying to warn people about the risks of scam janitorial franchises and the lies and deceptions of the people who promote and/or defend them. Your continual contradictions and distortions provide great examples! And for that, I thank you!

  I can tell you’re getting tired and frustrated. The reason is that you are arguing contradictions and trying to justify the years you spent contributing to a corrupt company and segment of the industry. Since you’re lying to yourself, it’s easy to argue rings around you.

• Guest: Really, I’ll come completely clean when you do the same. At least my first name is “Jerry” is yours “guest”?

  No lies, No deception. Simple FACTS. Also stated so many times, don’t believe Me, certainly don’t believe YOU, certainly don’t believe 1st Amendment. VERIFY for yourselves. TAKE your time. LOOK closely at what you”re buying and WHO you are investing with.

  “Corrupt” here we go again, making false and implying that criminal actions have taken place. WHAT a PILE of smoking MONKEY DUNG that is. Don’t make false accusations like that, if there were criminal acts, people would be in jail especially with all the publicity that owner/operator systems have been getting. That’s just pure garbage and another reason that people don’t TRUST you and 1st amendment as much as you think they do.

• If you notice the lawsuits seem to all have some very common facts. It’s no longer a question of no company is perfect but a crime that keeps being commited over and over, year after year.

  To me they are also in violation of the Rico and Racketeering Acts.

  Yared Bevene. et al v. Coverall of [sic] North America. Inc,,, Pacific Commercial Services. LLC. Coverall Cleaning Concepts and Coverall of Nashville. Inc. (Davidson County, Tennessee, Case No. 06-1202), filed May 12, 2006. There were five named plaintiffs who purported to be franchisees of Coverall or Coverall”s Service Franchisee, Pacific Commercial Services, LLC (“PCS”)- The plaintiffs alleged violations of the Tennessee Consumer Protection Act, fraud in the inducement, and negligent misrepresentation. The case was removed to the United States District Court for the Middle District of Tennessee on June 22, 2006 and assigned Case No. 3:06-0628. Plaintiffs filed an Amended Complaint on October 17, 2006 adding two additional plaintiffs. Mediation was held on September 13, 2007, and the case was settled. Coverall paid the seven Plaintiffs, five putative plaintiffs, and their attorney $37,500.

• “if there were criminal acts, people would be in jail”

  More delightful logical fallacy from Jerry. People cannot be creating crimes or they would be in jail!

  Bernard Madoff started his ponzi scheme in the early 80s. For 28 years, Jerry could have said “if there were criminal acts, Madoff would be in jail!” Unfortunately, in 2009, people realized that billions can be swindled before anyone goes to jail.

  Keep’m coming, Jerr-bear.

  PS my name actually is “guest” Just like yours is Jerry.

• Guest: How funny you are, did you get “burnt” by Bernie, is that why you are so bitter, someone got your money and now you feel like you need “revenge”. Here’s the problem, the very same people you supposidly “respect” the 46.5 million Hispanic-Americans (by the way, there really isn’t 46.5 million “hispanic-americans”, common sense dictates that not all of them are “Legal” therefore they can’t be “americans” in any sense) how many of them do you think are part of the current Thirty Thousand plus owner/operators currently cleaning facilities each and every night across this GREAT COUNTRY of ours?

  What about them, what’s your plan for them, how are you going to “justify to them” if you’d actually win? Here’s the TRUTH, YOU don’t care, YOU haven’t thought that “far ahead”, In your mind they are no different than “aiwah” was to Liz (TEST CASE) So don’t go all “biblical” on me, don’t call me names, don’t try and label me and here you can’t even give straight answers to a simple question: WHAT ABOUT THEM????

  Answer the question, get off your “high horse” and label “racists, racists” and not everyone who simply disagrees with you and has a little bit of actual and true AMERICAN PRIDE and DIGNITY. You want to come to this GREAT COUNTRY, then do it the right way, go through the process like millions of others already have.

• 1st amendment: Lawsuits have a “common theme” because attorneys all come from the same “band wagon” if it worked before, it will work again. Only difference this time vs. the past, the Franchising companies are tired of the “nonsense” and instead of “settling” which got them no where, which actually hurt them and brought on more lawsuits. This time, they are growing a “pair” and fighting back.

  1st amendment, you’re going to lose just like “aiwah” did. It’s going to cost you and your “merry band of disgruntled owner/operators”, after a few more “nose bleeds” maybe then Liz and her “crack pot team” of Progressive lovin, Marxist swearin, Obama kissin attorneys will quit putting up “TEST CASES”.

  You are right about one thing though, JUDGEMENT DAY is coming, problem is, it’s coming for you.

• Why do cleaning franchisors hurt people like Mr. Padilha and Mr. Martins. Please read part of the following article that came out in the New York Times.

  What was hapening in 2005 is still hapening today in 2010.

  To read the whole article you can go to the following link.

  http://www.nytimes.com/2005/07/13/national/13franchising.html

  Lawsuits Charge Fraud in Cleaning Business

  By STEVEN GREENHOUSE
  Published: July 13, 2005

  João Padilha had been saving money from his work as a restaurant deliveryman outside Boston when he heard a tantalizing offer to buy a cleaning franchise.

  Marcos Martins, a Brazilian immigrant like Mr. Padilha, was looking to go into business.

  Tri Duc Nguyen, a Vietnamese immigrant in Portland, Ore., needed a way to make money after Fujitsu closed the factory where he worked.

  All three men put thousands of dollars into cleaning franchises and say they were shortchanged.

  As Mr. Padilha retells it, the top Boston representative of Coverall Cleaning Concepts said he could make $3,000 a month cleaning buildings if he paid $12,880 for a franchise. What is more, Mr. Padilha says he was told he could easily parlay his investment into a large cleaning business.

  So Mr. Padilha paid the money and was assigned two women’s health clinics, in Haverhill and Newburyport, Mass.

  He was told it would take two and a half hours a day to clean the clinics, but it took six hours, he said. Coverall also gave him two dialysis clinics, and soon he was cleaning and shuttling among clinics from 5:30 p.m. to 7 a.m. on weekdays, with six more hours on weekends.

  He estimated that he worked 65 hours a week and 280 hours a month. But his receipts show that Coverall, which handled payments, paid him $1,262 a month, less than half what he says he had been promised.

  “I was doing all this work, but the check was for very little money,” Mr. Padilha said.

  So he went to the director of Coverall’s Boston office to complain.

  “When I came in, they said I had no more work,” Mr. Padilha said. “He said the supervisor of one clinic no longer wanted me. They took all my work away in one fell swoop. I asked for my franchise money back, but they said no.”

  “It’s sad for a man to cry, but I left that room crying,” he added.

  Mr. Padilha said he recouped none of his investment and soon learned that Mr. Martins had obtained the franchise to clean the dialysis clinics.

  Mr. Martins said: “I asked why the person who was doing it before had discontinued the work. The field consultant told me the person had gone back to Brazil.”

  Mr. Martins put $5,000 down and promised to pay $306 a month for two years to obtain a franchise that he was told would generate $2,000 a month for him. He said he cleaned clinics 72 hours a week, about 300 hours a month, but received just $1,366.

  He, too, was, abruptly terminated at the clinics for reasons he says he never understood.

  A dozen franchisees, including Mr. Padilha and Mr. Martins, are suing Coverall, charging it with fraud, breach of contract and failing to pay the minimum wage. They assert that the company took out improperly large commissions and did not have enough customers to supply franchisees.

• 1st amendment: Well I hope to GOD that these people are suing the crap out of Coverall, IF what they say is true! You don’t know it’s True, I don’t know it’s True, But if it is, They should SUE and I HOPE THEY WIN!!!!!!! If its true.

• “Well I hope to GOD that these people are suing the crap out of Coverall, IF what they say is true! You don’t know it’s True, I don’t know it’s True, But if it is, They should SUE and I HOPE THEY WIN!!!!!!! If its true”

  You’re so full of it, Jerry. If they were on here right now you’d be berating them for not having read the UFOC, for not doing their due diligence, for not calling the disconnected phone numbers the franchisor supplied, etc. etc.

  This is the same story told over and over about Coverall, Jan-pro, Jani-king and the other janitorial franchise scams. No difference. It’s institutionalized fraud and you spend hours every day trying to deny it.

• Guest: The problem, well one of the many problems with you is, you cannot distinguish FACT from FICTION. I can say what I say for many reasons, some of which are as follows:

  1. I’m an honest broker, your not: You have a financial stake in the outcome of what does/doesn’t happen with at least some of these lawsuits. I have none.

  2. Now you should know this, maybe your not as smart as you think if you don’t, but not everything is true just because SOMEONE says it is. That’s why their are courts, arbitrators, mediators that are all part of the “system”. If something clears the “burden of proof”, which you know that “bar” is extremely low, then it proceeds. When it proceeds, there are opportunities for BOTH sides to state their case, offer their “proof” and talk in a professional, non-garbage manner about the proof the have and attempt to “dispell” the proof the other side has. Then in most cases like this, a “Jury of Peers” gives their verdict in regards to what they saw, what the law says, what they believe based upon their knowledge, common sense etc…. But guess what, not all jury’s come out with the proper verdict every time ie…. OJ Simpson is/was GUILTY of murdering his former wife and Ron Goldman.

  3. Finally, just because you have a financial stake in the outcome of what may or may not happen, you’ve decided to get onto sites such as this and “spew” conjecture and attempt to make it FACT. The reason I’m on this site, is to remind people just because someone says somthing, doesn’t make it TRUE. They needed to understand that 1st amendment has a vested interest in the outcome of this “MESS”, You obviously have a vested interest in the outcome of this “MESS” and that they shouldn’t believe YOU, ME or ever believe 1st amendment without verifying what is said.

  For the record, as this will be my final posting, I find you a disgusting human being and I’m not going to dignify your statements about people, states, regions, religion, politcal parties etc… any more by continuing to post here.

  The admin of this site should have warned you and they chose not too. Therefore, they lack credibility in my eyes as well.

• Jerry writes: “this will be my final posting”

  Thank you, baby Jesus. Please give him the strength to not contradict himself this time. It will be a first, I know, but with you all things are possible.

• Guest/SEIU: Well you’re right for once, couldn’t Help myself. Just had to come back and “torture you” with my mere prescence. After getting my recent check from the “big 3”, I went out, purchased a twelve pack of my favorite adult beverage, calmed down, took a breath and realized that I couldn’t HELP MYSELF and just had to come back to counter the pure GARBAGE spewing on a regular basis from you and 1st amendment.

  Now I must say, I’m getting tired of the “race” and “bigot” nonsense. I must apologize to your parents, I never should have said what I did. I was mad, I was “pissed off” and I was “hurt”. I know they did the best they could in raising you and still despite their hard work and efforts, You still turned out to be an SEIU lovin, Progressive believin, Karl Marx supportin, OBAMA cravin, Socialist spewin , Son of a GUN!!!!!

  As “dude love”, “cactus jack”, “nick foley”, “mankind” would say BRING IT ON!!!!!! The FAT MAN is back in the HOUSE!!!!!!!

• Guest/SEIU: I’m actually surprised that you even know who Jesus is. I mean, the way you talk about people, the way you label people, the way you take remarks out of context, the fact you have a continued loathing of this GREAT COUNTRY. You see, the problem with you and your PROGRESSIVES are as follows:

  1. You want this Country dropped from the Exceptional Level to the Level of the rest of the Socialist Countries in this world like France and Germany.

  2. You want this Country dropped from having the “GIT R DONE” philosophy to the “Take a Nap” philosophy

  3. Your want to take this Country from being Pioneers to simply being “Wait and See”

  4. You want to take this Country from being a Leader to being “one of the League of Nations”.

  Your heros are Karl Marx, Joseph Stalin, Adolf Hitler, Hugo Chavez

  My heros are Ronald Regan, John Kennedy, Patton, John Wayne those currently and formally that served in the Military.

  You don’t love people, you love yourself. You’re so arrogant that you think and others that think like you know better how to do things, how to run things then I do, Joe A. does and any other “average american”. Got NEWSFLASH that TELEMUNDO and their “cracker jack” news reoporter can even find the story on, YOU”RE WRONG!!!!!! Average people are what/who founded this country, they are the one’s that came back from WWII and became the GREATEST GENERATION, they are the ones that fight every day in countries far away for the FREEDOM of others, they are the one’s like Joe A. that go out there and DO IT ALL! on a daily basis. Yes, SEIU (formally known as guest) they are JUST LIKE ME!!! I started a business, I built a business, I sold that business , I pay taxes, I give to Charity, I do the little things, that make this a little better place every day!!!

  YOU speak of JESUS, You and others like you, want to take JESUS out of the schools, out of the city squares, out of the court rooms, out of the government, out of people’s LIVES, out of the marketplace. People like you are going to LOSE in November, People like you are going to LOSE in these Lawsuits as ell.

• Guest/SEIU: Oh yea, by the way, before you call me an IMMIGRANT HATER as you have done before, I don’t hate anyone (except maybe you and Osama Bin Laden) but here’s the facts: Average Americans are tired of paying for illegal immigrants, they are tired of paying for their Health Care, they are tired of supporting them with subsidies, they are tired of being “labeled” as they point out that their ancestors entered this country the “RIGHT WAY” they did things “IN THE LAW”, they are tired of putting them in jail, paying for their deportation only to have them Re-enter the country illegally once again because the FEDERAL GOVERNMENT doesn’t do anything about securing and closing the BOARDERS.

  Problem is the Government is being run by a bunch of “poltically correct” politicians and not by the FOUNDERS of this COUNTRY the PEOPLE!!!!!!!

  HOLLER!!!!!! If you want to end this topic on this site!

• Jerry writes: “I’m actually surprised that you even know who Jesus is.”

  I was actually referring to Jesús, an illegal immigrant I met at the “boarder”

  Jerry writes: “Problem is the Government is being run by a bunch of “poltically correct” politicians and not by the FOUNDERS of this COUNTRY the PEOPLE!!!!!!!”

  Yeah, maybe we should start electing our Presidents with open, democratic elections! Great idea Jerr! I’ll get the founding fathers on that right away!

  Personally, I think we should all get our social, economic & immigration policies from people who quote Larry the Cable guy but can’t spell “Ronald Reagan” or “border” or know the difference between “formally that served in the Military” and “formerly served in the Military”

  Who says illiteracy is a problem in America?

• SEIU: Again, attack the “spelling” attack the “speech” never attack the substance. Your arrogance is showing itself again. Obviously, you are PERFECT in every way, you know what’s best for everyone, why don’t people just SHUT UP and listen to your “Thoughts”. HERE’S Why, they are the thoughts of a Communist, Marxist, Socialist. They aren’t the thoughts, hopes, beliefs of the MAJORITY, they are the disgusting thoughts, disgusting manifests of a time of Rulers who think they know better than the PEOPLE!!!!

  It is time for a REVOLUTION in America!!!! NOT ONE WITH GUNS, one with thoughts, thoughtful men and women, people of common sense, good morals, wanting to do things in the RIGHT WAY!!!! Vote the BUMS in Washington out!!!! I don’t just mean Democrats/Progressives either.

  SHAME ON ARIZONA REPUBLICANS for not getting behind either the Tea Party Nominated person or JD Hayworth!!!! McCain is a war hero, but he is a RHINO. He’s as Progressive as TEDDY ROOSEVELT and comes from the same mold as Bill Clinton, Hillary Clinton, Ted Kennedy and others. HE actually had the audacity of calling Ted Kennedy a GREAT MAN. REALLY!!!! This the same man that got away with murder, this is the same man that helped his nephew get off a RAPE charge, this is the same man that made backroom deals with the Communist Leaders of several countries. THAT GREAT MAN? REALLY!! He’s no GREAT MAN, he’s a thief, a liar, a murderer, a cheat, a TREASONIST SCUM.

  Sorry, guess I don’t have the politcal correctness as SEIU has. Wait a second, he’s as bad.

• Jerry, why don’t you save your misguided political rants for your Tea-bagger rallies or the drunks down at the Corncob, Indiana VFW? They at least can turn their hearing aids off and pretend they’re listening.

  People aren’t here for a redneck political lecture from someone who can’t even spell the names of recent Presidents they supposedly admire. Get your GED and maybe the grown-ups will let you join in to adult discussions.

  The topic of this thread is Coverall and how they scam & swindle people’s hopes and dreams. Take your meds, wash it down with some “sweat” tea and get back to defending your con artist “Masters.”

• Another lawsuit this time coverall had to pay the Plaintiffs $14,200

  Jubilee General Contracting LTD. et al v. Coverall North America, Inc.. et al. (State of Michigan, County of Oakland), Case No. 07-080927-C2, filed February 20, 2007. Plaintiffs claim that they were fraudulently induced to accept two cleaning contracts; because they were shown documents by Defendant JLAG Janitorial Service, LLC that contained erroneous data about expenses related to the two accounts. Coverall filed a Motion for Summary Disposition and for Attorney Fees and Costs on April 23, 2007, relying upon the mandatory mediation and arbitration provisions of the Janitorial Franchise Agreement. Coverall prevailed on its motion. On September 6, 2007, Coverall paid the plaintiffs the sum of $14,200.00; and plaintiffs waived their right to appeal, and the case was dismissed with prejudice on July 25, 2007.

• Maybe “Coverall” should be renamed “CoverUp.”

• SEIU: What’s the matter, getting a little too hot under the collar for you: Ok, lets take people on a summary of what is and what isn’t TRUE in this lawsuits: See if you can stay with me for a moment: Maybe you need to take a break, get with your other Progressive, SEIU, Attorney loving bunch of friends and family and ponder this:

  1. Franchisors are supposidly “predatory” in nature when it comes to minorities in general, immigrants specifically. Well, I disproved that with some basic rational thought in regards to the commercial cleaning industry as a whole being dominated with a minority prescence from top to bottom. I also made the point that “side” areas such as Hotels, Airports, Restaurants, City Buildings, State Buildings etc… are cleaned by minorities and immigrants. Therefore, they fell comfortable in the industry, want to try another aspect of something that they know about. I also used the “captain crunch” and why they don’t advertise on certain programs. At the same time, I was able to work in TELEMUNDO, Progressives, Democrats in general, Karl Marx, SEIU and others.

  2. Franchisors are “charged” with the statement “FDD is too difficult, too long and too hard to understand”. Well, explained that the FDD is really a document built into thirds. Approx. 1/3 is directly from the FTC and local/state/federal government mandats, Approx. 1/3 is from the friends of SEIU and 1st amendment and of Jan-Pro, Coverall, Jani-King and others aka ATTORNEYS, Approx. 1/3 actually means something in regards to the relationship between the unit franchisee, the customer and the regional or “master” office. Would I like for the FDD to be simple, YES. Would I like for it to be smaller, YES. But guess what, it’s not going to happen. MAYBE, if there was a way for the prospective “owner/operator” to take it home, read it at their own pace, get some assistance whether that assistance be from a friend, family member, accountant, lawyer, pastor or someone else!!!! Wait just a second, there is!!!!!!! They are allowed to take the document, they are allowed to take as much time, show it to as many people, give it a complete “once over” hell, they can even WALK AWAY!!!!!!!!!

  3. Franchisors are blamed for the “underbidding” of accounts. Well, I took the time, combined with my over 25 Years in the commercial cleaning field, to totally break down how traditional companies bid, the “big 3” bid, etc… I also made points validated by others that “post” from time to time on this site that the biggest “WHORES” of the marketplace happen to be as follows: ABM, other “national companies”, ABM, “mom and pops” , ABM, “regional companies, ABM. DID I MENTION, ABM!!!!! I also stated that in each “master office” there are drawers full, boxes full, file cabinets full of potential customers that they didn’t get because THEY WEREN’T THE LOWEST BIDDER!!!

  4. Franchisors are blamed for not “policing” the “masters”. This is one Point that I totally agree with. I have actually written suggested reforms, would like to see reforms in place etc….. It disgusts me when a few “rogues” take advantage and don’t do business the proper way!

  5. Franchisors are blamed for everything that goes wrong with a unit franchisee. Well that’s plan STUPID. There are no guarantees, all there is for these “owners” is a guideline that if followed will ultimately lead to a reasonable level of success. NO ONE is going to make a million dollars per year in this industry unless you are the chairman of ABM or majority owner of a large regional or national company. Yes, Jani-King founder Jim Cavanaugh is probably in that group as well.

  6. Franchisors are blamed for “churning” of accunts. In some instances that may be true, in most, I can guarantee you that it isn’t. WHY? Because the CUSTOMER wouldn’t put up with it. AT the end of the day, the “master”, the “unit” , the “masters employees” and to a degree “corporate” all work for THE CUSTOMER!!!! Of course anyone with any “industry sense” knows that. Unfortunately, SEIU, 1st amendment and some others, have NONE or very little, yet they pretend to know EVERYTHING!!!

  7. Franchisors are blamed for taking advantage of situations. Well, guess what, that goes on daily in business. You have no further to look than Washington D.C, Wall Street, Corporate Board Rooms, Union Halls throughout this country and see that happening every day. Doesn’t make it right, JUST FACTUAL.

  1st amendment. Keep finding lawsuits, all you are doing is proving my point. It’s cheaper to settle, than it is to fight. Coverall especially has allowed things to go on too long. Finally it seems though, they have learned their lesson and are “fighting back”.

  SEIU you are a JOKE, you will always be one to me.

• SEIU: You’re so FUNNY!!! “Maybe Coverall should be named Cover Up”. Oh, my sides are splitting! Could you think of something, anything at all? How about answering my Question of the Day: WHAT’S NEXT?

  You can’t seem to grasp your large ego, arrogant, Progressive, Socialist, Karl Marx lovin HEAD around that simple question.

  Tell you what, answer that question, give it some thought, take your time, take a week or so to respond. What? YOU DON’T CARE what’s next. You couldn’t give a HOOT about these people, you don’t want to be associated with these people, all you want to do is LINE YOUR OWN POCKETS. What? I thought you were for the Workers of the World.

  Come on, one little thought. It’s a simple question asked by a simple minded man. Show us your brillance, share with us your vast commercial cleaning knowledge, share with us the fact that you’ve put some thought into something, show us that your not a STOOGE!!!

• The janitorial/commercial cleaning segment of franchising is franchise industry’s greatest embarrassment. In the franchise industry, janitorial franchise companies are kind of like the creepy child molesting uncles of the family. In most families (other than Jerry’s) they put up with the creepy uncle, but prefer he stay in the corner and eat by himself at get-togethers.

  Only Vending has a stigma as bad as janitorial franchises, and most of those aren’t franchises. It’s so bad that the FTC has issued special warning guides specifically for commercial cleaning franchises. It does that for no other kind of franchise since none are as scam-infested as those Jerry spends all his time defending.

  Jerry the flip-flopping Tea-bagger writes as if these allegations about underbidding, churning accounts, not delivering contracted accounts, etc. were invented by the commenters here.

  Read the FTC’s expose of this ongoing scam. You’ll see they warn about all the exact same underhanded tactics that Jerry and the scam-denier corporate shills say don’t exist.

  FTC’s Guide to Buying a Janitorial Services Franchise
  http://www.unhappyfranchisee.com/category/new-unhappy-franchisees/cleaning-franchises/

• SEIU: Well of course you didn’t answer the “Question of the Day”. What’s the matter, 1st amendment got your tongue. I find it funny how you call everyone and everything an embarassment except for yourself.

  Here’s some continual “food for thought’ in regards to SEIU and his “goons”.

  1. Franchising in the Commercial Cleaning field has been the most scrutinized in the industry as a whole. When ABM is forced to “fire” 1200 illegal immigrants cleaning buildings throughout the greater St. Paul/Minneapolis area, what does SEIU have to say about that?

  2. Franchising though admittedly not “perfect” at least attempts to find out more about the potential “owner/operator” through it’s use of credit checks, national criminal background checks, verification of social and ITIN numbers as a precurser to anyone wanting to own a “unit franchise”.

  3. Franchising though not perfect, is the only place SEIU (I mean the actual SEIU, not the one formally known as “guest”) can’t seem to make any in roads. As stated previously by me, it’s amazing how SEIU continually doesn’t talk about the failied “Justice for Janitors” campaign and the effects of that campaign now in the various cities that it “lauched” at.

  Could that be one of the many reasons that SEIU is paying for the attorneys fees for various “disgruntled owner/operators” such as 1st amendment?

• Another lawsuit lost by Coverall. Coverall had to pay unemployment benefits to one of there cleaners who was missclasified and not a franchisee but an employee acording to the LAW.

  Coverall North America, Inc. v. Com’r of Div. of Unemployment , 447 Mass. 852 (2006) (amicus) (Supreme Judicial Court held that “franchisee” cleaning worker was employee entitled to unemployment compensation upon termination, not independent contractor)

• 1st amendment: Take your time, continue to find lawsuits, of course this one was inititated by Coverall against MA. In this case was the “trigger” for Liz and her “merry band of attorneys” to go to the SEIU and state the following: ” If you can pay us enough money, I can guarantee you a victory, we’ll find some poor unsuspecting SAP to go along for the ride, take him to places he’s never been before and we’ll have so many of them, we should be able to win at least one or two overall cases”.

  Now those probably weren’t Liz’s exact words, but you get the premise of it Right? You also understand that YOU, Aiwah and some of the others are the people that I described as “poor unsuspecting SAP” Right?

• OMG I can’t stop laughing at Jerry’s cut-rate due-diligence advice.

  He advises that you should save money by getting a $150 an hour or less lawyer with no franchise experience to review your franchise agreement, and then advise him/her “not to read every word”

  Yes, just tell your attorney you’ll only pay to have them read “the important words” ROFLMAO!

  Sane people might want to consider buying an hour or two of “Liz and her merry band of attorneys” time since they already know these agreements inside and out and can explain the true risks.

  This is your money, your time and your family’s future at stake. Be smart and do your homework beforehand.

• SEIU: Yeah, “Liz and her merry band of attorneys” are real smart. I’m sure “aiwah” is really appreciating her efforts. Can you ask him how it feels to be a “test case” and have a 200K judgement against him and his “co-plantiffs”. Let’s see, probably somone should have done more homework before bringing these lawsuits in the first place.

  Now, who between you and I has consistently stated “DO YOUR HOMEWORK”. let me count the number of times I’ve said that, oh HELL, you do it, you’re usually counting words anyway.

• More Violations this time in Tennessee. Lawsuits filled all across the country. Will it ever end? Can you see the Racket and Rico Violations.

  Isam Yonis v. Coverall North America. Inc., (Circuit Court of Williamson County, Tennessee, Case No. 04695), filed November 9, 2004. Plaintiff filed a one count Complaint alleging unspecified violations of the Tennessee Consumer Protection Act. We filed a Motion for More Definite Statement, which was never answered. The case was settled on January 8, 2007 for $12,500. The case was dismissed with prejudice on January 26, 2007.

• 1st amendment: When will you ever “stop” the nonsense. ARE you even capable of understanding the “Bigger Picture”. You continue to “babble” about History, well guess what, it’s done. Question of the Day: WHATS NEXT!!!!!

• 1st amendment; Though you are having your attorney’s fees paid by a third party (SEIU, no not that one, the other one) not everyone has the connections that obviously “liz and her merry band of attorneys do”. Unfortunately for “aiwah” and his “co-plantiffs” they are 200K poorer than what they were, they’ve wasted years of emotion, physical stress, mental stress, false hopes and aspirations for what? To be classified as a “test case” and have a 200K judgement against them.

  Where’s your stake? When you lose and you will, what have you accomplished, how many others have you “lead” down the path of no reward.

  Talk about looking at your “maker” at some point in time.

• I just took an interesting stroll through Coverall’s 2009 FDD, which is available through the California Dept. of Corporations website. Perhaps ADMIN would be so kind as to post it here for all to see.

  In the required “Litigation” section there is reference to 16 lawsuits against franchisee lawsuits against Coverall that had been concluded (in addition to several still ongoing). COVERALL ended up PAYING in EVERY ONE of the sixteen lawsuits. Here are the amounts paid by Coverall:

  1) $20,000
  2) $37,500
  3) $14,500
  4) $12,500
  5) $20,000
  6) $300,000
  7) $17,000
  8 ) $13,000
  9) $30,000
  10) $7,000
  11) $3,575
  12) $13,000
  13) $450,000
  14) $45,000
  15) $30,000
  16) $55,000

  So the good news is that Coverall can be consistently exposed and brought to justice in a court of law or arbitration. The bad news is, these settlements surely did not cover all the losses, time, aggravation, & attorneys fees suffered by these franchise owners.

  Try spinning that, Jerry, you pathetic scammer.

• SEIU: No scam unlike you and 1st amendment: HERE’s your answer to the above: They made a mistake by settling these cases. Even though it was cheaper to “settle” they made an Error. That error is/has been corrected via the “aiwah” case.

  Now, here’s your Question of the Day: WHATS NEXT? Simple question posed by a SIMPLE MAN.

  Next:

  1. Why don’t you finally reveal yourself as an SEIU member?

  2. Why don’t you admit that 1s amendment cannot pay his attorney bills and that someone else is paying them on his behalf?

  3. Why can’t you admit you have a “vested” interest in the outcome of these cases?

  4. Why can’t you admit that you are worried?

  5. Why can’t you admit that you nor “liz and her merry band of attorneys” even return “aiwah’s” calls anymore. Since his “test case” lost, they have no use for him.

• SEIU: So on one post you claim “lawsuits are so goooood” but the problem is you didn’t say for whom? You say on this site, “I admit, it probably didn’t cover the legal expenses or even get their money back”. So how did it benefit them exactly.

  You left one out that we all know about now……”aiwah” what about the 200K that Coverall is now owed by him? You claim, a “judgement against someone who has nothing, doesn’t matter”. So you think “aiwah” is ok with this do you? Are you that stupid, that arrogant, that uncaring, that disgusting? Obviously, YES..

  I don’t know ‘aiwah” personally, but I guarantee you that he is a proud man, head of a proud family, now he is devasted and all you can say is ? Who cares.

• This time someone takes action in Florida against Coverall.

  Another Breach of contract.

  Bradley Carter v. Coverall North America. Inc. (Broward County, Florida, Circuit Court of the Seventeenth Judicial Circuit, Case No. Case No. 06-011532(08), filed on August 2, 2006. Coverall moved to dismiss the Complaint in its entirety. In lieu of a response, Carter filed a First Amended Complaint (the “Amended Complaint”) on October 9, 2006. The Amended Complaint alleged breach of contract and violation of �559 of the Florida Statutes pertaining to business opportunities. Coverall moved to dismiss the complaint based upon failure to engage in mediation, statute of limitations grounds and the inapplicability of �559 of the Florida Statutes to franchises. The parties mediated the dispute on December 19, 2006 and Coverall paid the Plaintiff $20,000. The case was dismissed with prejudice on December 26, 2006.

• 1st amendment: Acient History again. Let’s talk about TODAY, Let’s talk about how “aiwah” feels, Let’s talk about the “Big 3” deciding that they aren’t going to settle cases anymore, Let’s talk about how “aiwah” and others to follow (including you) will have JUDGEMENTS filed against them and how all of you will end up in Bankruptcy Court, Let’s talk about TODAY (meaning soon) when SEIU (no not that one, the other one) pulls the plug on the monies being paid to “Liz and her perfectly pissed off, no good, unhappy and drunk band of attorneys” and you and others are left holding a piece of paper in the middle of the court room which simply states “CASE DISMISSED”.

• SEIU: OH GOD, Please forgive me I meant ancient not acient, I’m sorry SEIU I’ll try not to let this happen again, I’m typing too fast, got to go soon, I ‘ve got to rob, steal, cheat, defame, purge, clean toilets, lie to customers, lie to owner/operators, lie to you, your momma and Catholic Religion today!!!!

• You’re still writing about the “Coverall Trail.”

  Where is that, exactly. It sounds interesting. I hear 16 out of 16 plaintiffs struck gold along the “Coverall Trail.”