JAN-PRO Franchise Complaints

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• Pete: As stated on the other "post" have very few exceptions to what you're saying, already said all of those things prior in regards to "due dilligence".

  Have a great day, but remember what I said about ABM, They are the biggest "whore" in the commercial cleaning industry in regards to pricing and national accounts.

• And Jerry I took your comment above to heart. You are correct. I too feel for the little person. It is just my, very industry minded , opinion that this business model does not in any way look out for these little guys.

• Pete:

  Great advice, well stated. People who buy a franchise in an industry they don't understand are at the mercy of the franchisor. In this case, it makes sense to get enough experience that you can make a go of it with a business you truly own - for real. Many janitorial franchisees would have been ahead of the game had they worked for minimum wage - it's better than LOSING both your investment and your time to the sellers of false dreams.

  Thanks for a brief break from the ramblings of Jerry, who wants to remind everyone ad nauseum that he's a "Nascar lovin, White Gravy eatin, cousin-marrying, corn bread making, sheep chasing, chicken fried steak eatin, illegal immigrant hatin, stump jumpin, book burnin, plastic flag wavin, cross burnin' , English language-butcherin Southern Gentleman that LOVES this COUNTRY & its brave VETERANS more than YOU ever will as evidenced by his USE OF ALL CAPS and cuz he sez so!!!"

• To jerry the master franchisor in Indiana

  Here we go again with your Deceptive jan-pro shameful comparisons.

  Your coughing up more swine.

  Now your trying to say that someone who lost all of there money in jan-crap, who got thousands of Headaches from jan-crap, and who lost everything because of jan-crap would have been better of than investing in Microsoft or the stock market.

  More Deception and more LIES. Jan-crap thought you very well in there Deceptive classes.

  If I had invested my money in the stock market I would still have my shares plus the dividends. Plus I would have saved my self Thousands of Headaches from jan-crap. All the Lies, Deception, and Fraud. I could of had another job were I would have atleast made more than minimum wage not like at jan-crap were I was making less than Minimum wage.

  I know a lot of people who have invested $10,000, $20,000 , $25,000 and more and Now they have Nothing. All this in less than a year. In the stock market you could have saved yourself all the time and all the headaches from jan-pro plus jan-pros Threats and Lies.

  I also know people who have invested Thousands of Dollars and after 2 years they only have one jan-pro account left. What is there paycheck like? There paycheck is $30.00 Dollars a Month.

  Now there life savings are gone. If they would have invested it in the Market lets say Microsoft or Apple they would still have all of there shares plus dividends.

  They tell you that they Guarantee the accounts for a year but that is another LIE. They can and will steal them from you by making up bogus excuses that you are not cleaning right and tell you to turn in the account or face a fine of $500.00 Dollars a day. Once the people turn in there accounts and they go back and talk to the customer, the customer is Mad that there cleaner was removed! Why because the customer was very happy with the cleaners work.

  If you look at the Climaco Guzman V. jan-pro case you will see that jan-pro LIES. They never gave him any accounts so Climaco Guzman had to take legal action. The Judge found jan-pro Guilty!

  The Judge said that jan-pros promises were FALSE and MISSLEADING! The Judge also said that jan-pro had BREACHED the contract and committed FRAUD !

• 1st amendment: Well here you go again, noticed how you are speaking for Felix vs. Felix speaking for himself. I know, you know so many people, you talk with them all day, all night and you're still trying to understand why you need a "brokers license".

  Now in all seriousness, I think that your continued "third party" musings are getting so old, that it's time for you to reveal all of there names so ICE, I mean I can contact them personally so we can show them some Southern Hospitality as they continue their journey back to their homeland.

  Now, here, let's spend a few moments and compare facts to facts.

  Fact #1- you should realize that if you purchased stock in IBM, Apple or name a company of your choice (doubt that you invest in the stock market any way) but you pick one, find out what its purchase price was 4 years ago. For you that means 2006. Now look at what today's price is for that stock. I'll bet a dime to a dollar that in almost ALL cases, you have a loss. Now, let's take another moment for you to understand that not all stocks pay dividends. Also, even if you buy stock "online" you will still have to pay a fee in order to purchase that stock.

  Fact #2- If Jan-Pro treated EVERYONE as you describe, how would they stay in business? I mean in all honesty, let's think about this for a moment. The economy is tough, jobs are hard to come by, everyone is tightening their belts, most people are doing without something. Now if what you state as fact, was evenly remotely true, how does Jan-Pro have over 10,000 owner/operators working throughout the United States every night? Isn't that impossible if they didn't have any customers, because lets all admit, regardless if you are talking about "traditional companies", "mom and pops" , owner/operator companies etc... Don't we ALL get paid by the customer, the one we are to service every night/clean, sends in their checks every month etc...

  Fact #3- Jan-Pro's, Coverall"s, Jani-King's guarantees to its owner/operators are simply stated, if you take care of the customer and do things the "right way" we will make sure you have that customer for at least one year. Even Felix, who still hasn't responded (but you have, do you even know Felix) has stated, "he's been an owner/operator with Jan-Pro for 4 Years". Now in the title of "honest broker" that I own outright and without dispute from even "guest", he said more than that and he didn't like his "return on his investment". Though I proved extremely well.

  The case that you are quoting, please correct me if I'm wrong, without calling me names, (I have grown sensitive to the fact that you are making FAT jokes) that particular case is at least 15 years old.

  At some point and time, you need to forgive right? HOLLER if you have a "brokers license"!!!!!

• Guest: You little sly dog you, you almost made it sound that you liked Pete, when if you bothered to review everything that I've said for the last month plus is almost the same thing. Your biggest problem is, you don't bother to put 2 and 2 together and come up with 4 on a regular basis.

  Now, I would have no problem with everyone working for "traditional companies" at minimum wage. Because by the time they got their paycheck once or twice they'd be coming to Jan-Pro, Coverall, Jani-king etc.. Why do I make that statement, well, I knew you would ask that question because, you don't have any idea of what you are talking about:

  Employee making "minimum wage", I think it's still $7.25 per hour right, well lets give everyone an even $8.00 per hour. Now after taxes, Lets all be fair and state that they will be getting somewhere around $6.00 per hour for their work. Now that doesn't include gas, some companies make them pay for their uniforms, even more still make them pay for ID Badges and Background checks. But those are minor issues, let me talk about the 6.00 per hour.

  So they work 4 hours per night at one location, they've made 24.00 net pay, they work 5 days per week, so they take home 120.00 per week net.

  Now, here's where it gets interesting for "guest" . I bid that same job, the same way as the traditional company did. Of course, I bid using the $15.00 per hour described previously by me on numerous posts. using the same number of hours as "traditional company" and backing out the 20% (roughly) that Jan-Pro takes, owner/operator is roughly at 12.00 per hour. Now multiply it out, it becomes 48.00 per day, 240.00 per week.

  Now, I'm going to give you another secret, most traditonal companies don't have timeclocks at every site, some don't even have computer based time/in or out methods. So in most companies they are paying for 4 hours work and aren't getting 3.

  Here's another secret, a well trained, well equipped, well motivated owner/operator doesn't spend 4 hours there either.

  So at the end of the day, they are "grossing" more money. Now you're going to talk about taxes for the owner/operator and your going to go "see I told you so, it's nothing but a low paying job opportunity".. ok. here's a little secret for you, in most cases, because that owner/operator runs their business out of their home, they get to deduct a portion of their rent/mortgage, part of their phone bill, part of their electric bill, capital expenses, car payments/leases, OH and the list goes on and on.

  Here's another little secret, the vast majority well over 90% of Jan-Pro's owner/operators have been in the system for more than 1 year, better than 80% for two years or more.

  Want to know another little secret, Most of the 80% have recommended their family members and friends to purchase a franchise from Jan-Pro.

  Now, HOLLER if you Love this country!!!! Despite your statements about Southern People and the fact that I do "butcher" the language from time to time, I noticed your getting closer to the LIGHT!!!!!!

• I'm pretty sure in 1999 apple was at 2.90 a share. If you invested 10,000 then and held it until today where its at around 250 you'd have almost a million. However, you never heard of apple in 99 and today its ubiquitous. BUT if you aren't smart enough to figure out how to run a basic company on your own I don't suggest you own a piece (stock) of a very complicated company in the market. Let's all hug and be friends.

• Joe A: Yeah, it's all a "crap shoot" no matter what you end up doing. I guess in a way, that's kind of been my point all along. I've never said the system is perfect, I've shared with everyone the "reforms" that I would LOVE to see happen. I am a true fan of the concept under the right circumstances, with the proper amount of training, direction, oversite and proper explanation and "due dilligence" upfront.

  I would love to see Rich Kissane replaced, he wasn't good at his job at OneSource, I don't personally believe he is a "criminal though". Only one that I know isn't is Me. At the end of the day, that's all I hope any of us can say.

  Now there's always going to be some issues with the owner/operator system, even with "my" proposed reforms, but there are real issues that envolve "traditonal companies" as well.

  I don't "hate" 1st amendment, never did. I don't "hate" "guest" though it is a bit irritating calling him "guest". I actually feel bad for any owner/operator that even "feels" that he/she have been "screwed". But at the end of the day, you have to agree to take things on a case by case basis, if there are major "systemic" problems in the system, then maybe the best thing to do is "reform the system". Not destroy it. If you do that, then what happens to the thirty thousand plus owner/operators that paid just as much or more than 1st amendment did, what happens to their investment, what happens to their customer etc.....

  Now "guest" , don't think I've gotten all WARM and FUZZY about everything you've said!!!!

• Now here's a general "thought" that would actually appreciate anyone's view on other than 1st amendment.

  Can anyone without getting "legal" on me, explain the difference in realtionship between the following and what Jan-Pro's relationship is with the owner/operator?

  1. Trucking company with their owner/operator
  2. Insurance company with their independent agent
  3. Hospital with their independent contractor (usually a nurse)

  Now we all know about trucking companies from national companies like Crete Carrier to smaller operations like Dot Foods all use the owner/operator model.

  Aren't both of them in the "transportation/trucking business". Don't they all sign "exclusive rights" contracts, don't they all have "non-compete clauses", don't they all "work" under negotiated contracts between the transportation/trucking company and the "customer". There are penalties and rewards for being late/on time/early. There are "guarantees" of satisfaction, there are standards to be met.

  How about Insurance companies such as Progressive Insurance, they all are "indpendent agents" yet they aren't allowed to represent other insurance companies or sell other types of insurance other than the one's offered by Progressive.

  How about Hospitals. They have "independent contractors" with individual nurses being the primary "type" of worker under this contract. They work for "set payments", "set length of times" , can only work for a hospital owned/co-owned by the "parent hospital".

  Other than Judge Young, don't see much difference between what I've described above and Jan-Pro's relationship with its owner/operators. Food for thought, too many people try to compare Jan-Pro's relationship with it's owner/operators with McDonald's relationship to its franchisees. Though there are aspects that are similar, I think what is described above are closer. Does that mean in MA all of the above listed "professions" must now be listed as "employee only"?

• Don't hospitals pay nurses by the hour? And don't truckers get paid by the mile? Where as a franchisee gets paid by the subjective bid of a sales person. Where if jan pro bids a job at 4 hours and it takes you 6 you don't get paid for the additional 2 hours. You wouldn't if u botched a traditional companies bid either. I dunno about the trucker but I'm pretty sure a contracted nurse def gets an hourly wage and overtime.